GW2 is not dying or ending.

[Lahemic.6097]

I've held off on making this thread for a while. I keep seeing doomsayers say that GW2 is dying or on the brink of ending for one reason or another, which resulted in me and one of my old gamer buddies getting into a debate. I was able to stump him on some points, but I'm actually quite frustrated at how easily people are falling for rumors. I really want to break my silence on this issue, be it untimely or not. I'd like to put the players at ease here, and give some reassurance. Here's some things to keep in mind about the rumors going around, and how they are easily dismissed.

 

1. The player base isn't dying, nor is it dead. People that play a game for an extensive period of time tend to take breaks from them for a while. The drop in active players is simply due to people taking a break from the game. If runescape is up and running on its current playerbase, then this game is alive and well.

 

2. Guild wars 2 makes its mark in MMO history as one of the most well made MMORPGs with a F2P approach, rivaled only by Final Fantasy Online. The delivery of content, free events and items, cosmetics, etc, is a testament to their success.

 

3. The layoffs were nothing more than an investment decision on Arenas part. Just because a corporation lays off employees doesn't mean that they're in danger. If walmart lays off cashiers, it doesn't mean that the franchise is going down. It's just a business practice.

 

GW2 is alive, it's well, and it's surpassing the playerbase of games such as Runescape, Requiem: Bloodymare, Secret World, Etc. This game has even got an aspiring RP community, which is beginning to attract newcomers (Particularly WoW veterans). Relax and enjoy the game! :)

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

> @"Lahemic.6097" said:

> I've held off on making this thread for a while. I keep seeing doomsayers say that GW2 is dying or on the brink of ending for one reason or another, which resulted in me and one of my old gamer buddies getting into a debate. I was able to stump him on some points, but I'm actually quite frustrated at how easily people are falling for rumors. I really want to break my silence on this issue, be it untimely or not. I'd like to put the players at ease here, and give some reassurance. Here's some things to keep in mind about the rumors going around, and how they are easily dismissed.

>

> 1. The player base isn't dying, nor is it dead. People that play a game for an extensive period of time tend to take breaks from them for a while. The drop in active players is simply due to people taking a break from the game. If runescape is up and running on its current playerbase, then this game is alive and well.

>

> 2. Guild wars 2 makes its mark in MMO history as one of the most well made MMORPGs with a F2P approach, rivaled only by Final Fantasy Online. The delivery of content, free events and items, cosmetics, etc, is a testament to their success.

>

> 3. The layoffs were nothing more than an investment decision on Arenas part. Just because a corporation lays off employees doesn't mean that they're in danger. If walmart lays off cashiers, it doesn't mean that the franchise is going down. It's just a business practice.

>

> GW2 is alive, it's well, and it's surpassing the playerbase of games such as Runescape, Requiem: Bloodymare, Secret World, Etc. This game has even got an aspiring RP community, which is beginning to attract newcomers (Particularly WoW veterans). Relax and enjoy the game! :)

 

Just a small correction: As ArenaNet was as surprised as anyone, it wasn't ArenaNet that decided to lay off personnel. That was a parent-company decision.

And yes, indeed, no need to worry that the studio, nor the game, is 'dying'.

[Omernon.9762]

It is doing well right now, but this summer we will have WoW Classic which is already a huge success and attracts a lot of attention, even though it hasn’t been released yet. One could think that announcing a new expansion could be a good counter measure, because by the time ANet will release it, a large portion of players will get bored of WoW Classic and will look for the next big thing. We were instead promised new LWS and that won’t send message across, no matter how big it is.

[ProtoGunner.4953]

Your points are assumptions. And "the game is dying" is an assumption, too. It surely still has players but it lost a lot of momentum, internet popularity and popularity in general. In the best case the game is stagnating at an average-satisfying player count. I for my part haven't touched the game for months. Actually, I really throttled my gaming time since a couple of weeks after HoT release. And so did a lot of friends. But that's my perspective. And I was a GW-fan since early 2006.

[SexyMofo.8923]

Tell that to the wvw and PvP players.

[MikeG.6389]

> @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> Your points are assumptions. And "the game is dying" is an assumption, too. It surely still has players but it lost a lot of momentum, internet popularity and popularity in general. In the best case the game is stagnating at an average-satisfying player count. I for my part haven't touched the game for months. Actually, I really throttled my gaming time since a couple of weeks after HoT release. And so did a lot of friends. But that's my perspective. And I was a GW-fan since early 2006.

 

I see a lot of new accounts in game nowadays. I guess most of them are free-to-play players but still, the game attracts new blood and if they are here to stay, they will likely become paying customers, as well. The game is coming up on its seventh birthday later this year. I don't think it's fair to expect it to have the same kind of momentum and 'internet popularity' as it had around the launch of the main game and, to some extent, around the launch of the two expansions. OP's points might be assumptions, but they are based on solid reasoning. Those who say the game is dying are either trying to attract attention or are really saying that they are bored, which is not really the game's fault.

[bbop.9706]

I've been here nearly a year and i have waaaay to much to do and am having way too much fun doing it that even if there are zero major updates for a couple of years i'd be happy.

[Danikat.8537]

This seems to just be a common theme with MMOs. At any given time there's people declaring the end of each one - either claiming it's dying, already dead or going to die if/when they do something that person doesn't like and the vast majority of the time it's nonsense. Sometimes it's based on very limited data - like both that player's friends quit because a new game caught their attention so they assume everyone else has quit too. Other times as far as I can tell it's a weird form of defence mechanism - they've gone through a game actually shutting down before and now prefer to tell themselves their current game is doomed and going to fail any minute constantly, for years, so that if it does happen it's just what they expected all along and not a surprise.

 

> @"Omernon.9762" said:

> It is doing well right now, but this summer we will have WoW Classic which is already a huge success and attracts a lot of attention, even though it hasn’t been released yet. One could think that announcing a new expansion could be a good counter measure, because by the time ANet will release it, a large portion of players will get bored of WoW Classic and will look for the next big thing. We were instead promised new LWS and that won’t send message across, no matter how big it is.

 

It might be attracting a lot of attention from former WoW players, but there are also a lot of people who play other MMOs who chose not to play WoW for various reasons and I can't imagine a reboot of the game which didn't interest them originally will interest them now, unless it's fundamentally different (which would defeat the point of making a 'classic' edition).

 

I was going to list some of the changes they'd have to make to interest me, but basically it would need to be a totally different game. Especially since the original thing which put me off was when they destroyed Quel'thalas in Warcraft 3 and I realised you wouldn't be able to play as a high/sun elf. (Not a blood elf, that's not the same.)

[Kraljevo.2801]

Why do you care what other people think and why do you have such gullible friends?

 

You know the game is good, so play it.

[Konig Des Todes.2086]

> @"Kraljevo.2801" said:

> Why do you care what other people think and why do you have such gullible friends?

>

> You know the game is good, so play it.

 

The sad truth is that popular opinion does affect business. Especially MMOs. If a lot of people proclaim the game is dead and dying, that would mean people thinking of trying it becomes hesitant - no one wants to get into a game that's going to be taken down "soon". There would be people who leave because they believe the doomsayers, looking for a game that "won't die soon". Etc. Etc. Lower playerbase means lower sales, especially for a F2P/B2P game like GW2 who's primary profit comes in the form of gemstore sales no doubt.

 

It ends up becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy of sorts. Kind of like the show Firefly. People thought it wouldn't make it despite being good, so folks didn't watch it because they didn't want to get into something and enjoy it just for it to be canceled, and the lack of viewership resulted in it being canceled after one season.

[Tommo Chocolate.5870]

> @"Danikat.8537" said:

> I was going to list some of the changes they'd have to make to interest me, but basically it would need to be a totally different game. Especially since the original thing which put me off was when they destroyed Quel'thalas in Warcraft 3 and I realised you wouldn't be able to play as a high/sun elf. (Not a blood elf, that's not the same.)

 

I destroyed Quel'Thalas in Warcraft 2, and what did Blizzard do? They made me destroy it _again_ in Warcraft 3!

 

[mercury ranique.2170]

> @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > @"Lahemic.6097" said:

> > I've held off on making this thread for a while. I keep seeing doomsayers say that GW2 is dying or on the brink of ending for one reason or another, which resulted in me and one of my old gamer buddies getting into a debate. I was able to stump him on some points, but I'm actually quite frustrated at how easily people are falling for rumors. I really want to break my silence on this issue, be it untimely or not. I'd like to put the players at ease here, and give some reassurance. Here's some things to keep in mind about the rumors going around, and how they are easily dismissed.

> >

> > 1. The player base isn't dying, nor is it dead. People that play a game for an extensive period of time tend to take breaks from them for a while. The drop in active players is simply due to people taking a break from the game. If runescape is up and running on its current playerbase, then this game is alive and well.

> >

> > 2. Guild wars 2 makes its mark in MMO history as one of the most well made MMORPGs with a F2P approach, rivaled only by Final Fantasy Online. The delivery of content, free events and items, cosmetics, etc, is a testament to their success.

> >

> > 3. The layoffs were nothing more than an investment decision on Arenas part. Just because a corporation lays off employees doesn't mean that they're in danger. If walmart lays off cashiers, it doesn't mean that the franchise is going down. It's just a business practice.

> >

> > GW2 is alive, it's well, and it's surpassing the playerbase of games such as Runescape, Requiem: Bloodymare, Secret World, Etc. This game has even got an aspiring RP community, which is beginning to attract newcomers (Particularly WoW veterans). Relax and enjoy the game! :)

>

> Just a small correction: As ArenaNet was as surprised as anyone, it wasn't ArenaNet that decided to lay off personnel. That was a parent-company decision.

> And yes, indeed, no need to worry that the studio, nor the game, is 'dying'.

 

It depends a bit how you define Arenanet as an entity. Most people working there where surprised, but I have no doubt thatsomeone like Mike O knew about the worries that NCSoft had about this subsidiary and knew about this option

[Vayne.8563]

I think this post does more to hurt the game than help it. First thing I'd think seeing a post like this is to ask why people feel they need to make a post to say the game is alive and well. And the comment about the population being down due to people taking a break...based on what? Do you actually know the population? How do you even know it's down. I know it shifts around a lot depending on what's going on at any given time. People come back from LS chapters. Probably a lot of people coming to play SAB right now, but how would you know, since they're mostly in their own instances.

 

The real tale of the tape is the money the game is pulling in every quarter. The last quarter wasn't a great quarter, but it was the first mediocre quarter in a long time and we've had quarters lower than that a couple of years ago. All this stuff happens in cycles anyway. There's nothing in the quarterly report to suggest the game is even close to dying. However, the over all profit on NcSoft stocks are down. Investors want to see action. Companies do this all the time. Action is taken, confidence is restored, stock goes up. It's a kitten world, but it does happen quite frequently.

 

No one thinks blizzard is dying but they just laid off a bunch of people too.

 

Anyone who's paying attention knows the game isn't dying. Every MMO in existence has people in their forums saying the game is dying. The best strategy is to ignore those people, or simply refute their arguments with the facts you have.

[AlexxxDelta.1806]

While I agree that GW2 won't be ending anytime soon, I don't see a point in your MMO comparisons (except maybe Runescape). GW2 is nowhere near the same ballpark as B-rated titles like Secret World or Requiem (is that still online?). WoW, FFXIV, ESO, BDO and to an extent SWTOR are this game's direct competition and what GW2 has to be measured against.

 

Anet didn't decide a thing, the layoffs were mandated by NCsoft. And it wasn't just some temporary workers on unnamed projects that were laid off, but many prominent figures of GW2's (and GW) development team. These things don't happen if everything is rosy, especially since NCsoft CEO herself admitted that's not the case in her statement.

 

In my experience with MMO life-cycles, 2019 will be a pivotal year for the game. They may knock LS5 out of the park and deliver on their promise of "expansion-like" content. This will make headlines and send the message that Anet is pioneering once again, offering the type of content you pay for in other games, for free. Just like they originally planned it for this game before HoT. On the other hand, their promise might turn out empty and what we get is still 2 hrs of content every 3,5-4 months + map currency grind. The former will revitalize the game and alleviate any concerns the community is having about the future. The latter will prove doomsayers right and "send" the message that the game is in its "life support" phase, with barebones development until the cow has been milked dry.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

> @"mercury ranique.2170" said:

> > @"Inculpatus cedo.9234" said:

> > > @"Lahemic.6097" said:

> > > I've held off on making this thread for a while. I keep seeing doomsayers say that GW2 is dying or on the brink of ending for one reason or another, which resulted in me and one of my old gamer buddies getting into a debate. I was able to stump him on some points, but I'm actually quite frustrated at how easily people are falling for rumors. I really want to break my silence on this issue, be it untimely or not. I'd like to put the players at ease here, and give some reassurance. Here's some things to keep in mind about the rumors going around, and how they are easily dismissed.

> > >

> > > 1. The player base isn't dying, nor is it dead. People that play a game for an extensive period of time tend to take breaks from them for a while. The drop in active players is simply due to people taking a break from the game. If runescape is up and running on its current playerbase, then this game is alive and well.

> > >

> > > 2. Guild wars 2 makes its mark in MMO history as one of the most well made MMORPGs with a F2P approach, rivaled only by Final Fantasy Online. The delivery of content, free events and items, cosmetics, etc, is a testament to their success.

> > >

> > > 3. The layoffs were nothing more than an investment decision on Arenas part. Just because a corporation lays off employees doesn't mean that they're in danger. If walmart lays off cashiers, it doesn't mean that the franchise is going down. It's just a business practice.

> > >

> > > GW2 is alive, it's well, and it's surpassing the playerbase of games such as Runescape, Requiem: Bloodymare, Secret World, Etc. This game has even got an aspiring RP community, which is beginning to attract newcomers (Particularly WoW veterans). Relax and enjoy the game! :)

> >

> > Just a small correction: As ArenaNet was as surprised as anyone, it wasn't ArenaNet that decided to lay off personnel. That was a parent-company decision.

> > And yes, indeed, no need to worry that the studio, nor the game, is 'dying'.

>

> It depends a bit how you define Arenanet as an entity. Most people working there where surprised, but I have no doubt thatsomeone like Mike O knew about the worries that NCSoft had about this subsidiary and knew about this option

 

Not according to the people who were there; but, you'd have to believe what the Devs say, then.

[Ashen.2907]

> @"MikeG.6389" said:

> > @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > Your points are assumptions. And "the game is dying" is an assumption, too. It surely still has players but it lost a lot of momentum, internet popularity and popularity in general. In the best case the game is stagnating at an average-satisfying player count. I for my part haven't touched the game for months. Actually, I really throttled my gaming time since a couple of weeks after HoT release. And so did a lot of friends. But that's my perspective. And I was a GW-fan since early 2006.

>

> I see a lot of new accounts in game nowadays. I guess most of them are free-to-play players but still, the game attracts new blood and if they are here to stay, they will likely become paying customers, as well. The game is coming up on its seventh birthday later this year. I don't think it's fair to expect it to have the same kind of momentum and 'internet popularity' as it had around the launch of the main game and, to some extent, around the launch of the two expansions. OP's points might be assumptions, but they are based on solid reasoning. Those who say the game is dying are either trying to attract attention or are really saying that they are bored, which is not really the game's fault.

 

The OP's assumptions are based on no more solid reasoning than those who think the game is dying because their friends or guildies have stopped playing.

 

That said, I do not think that the game is in danger of dying at this time.

[Wiler.9873]

> @"SexyMofo.8923" said:

> Tell that to the wvw and PvP players.

 

I'm WvW PvP player but since I'm from tarnish coast I don't know if my opinion counts, but... WvW is hell in this place it never stops raiding for me.

[Deimos.4263]

I don't think the game is dead or dying but it does feel like it is in a bit of a slump. (Or perhaps pining for the fjords...)

[ProtoGunner.4953]

Also the fact that they don't seem to work on a new expansion is rather disheartening.

[Yannir.4132]

People have been saying WoW is dead for a decade now. Still the most played MMO.

[Klowdy.3126]

> @"Danikat.8537" said:

> This seems to just be a common theme with MMOs. At any given time there's people declaring the end of each one - either claiming it's dying, already dead or going to die if/when they do something that person doesn't like and the vast majority of the time it's nonsense. Sometimes it's based on very limited data - like both that player's friends quit because a new game caught their attention so they assume everyone else has quit too. Other times as far as I can tell it's a weird form of defence mechanism - they've gone through a game actually shutting down before and now prefer to tell themselves their current game is doomed and going to fail any minute constantly, for years, so that if it does happen it's just what they expected all along and not a surprise.

>

> > @"Omernon.9762" said:

> > It is doing well right now, but this summer we will have WoW Classic which is already a huge success and attracts a lot of attention, even though it hasn’t been released yet. One could think that announcing a new expansion could be a good counter measure, because by the time ANet will release it, a large portion of players will get bored of WoW Classic and will look for the next big thing. We were instead promised new LWS and that won’t send message across, no matter how big it is.

>

> It might be attracting a lot of attention from former WoW players, but there are also a lot of people who play other MMOs who chose not to play WoW for various reasons and I can't imagine a reboot of the game which didn't interest them originally will interest them now, unless it's fundamentally different (which would defeat the point of making a 'classic' edition).

>

> I was going to list some of the changes they'd have to make to interest me, but basically it would need to be a totally different game. Especially since the original thing which put me off was when they destroyed Quel'thalas in Warcraft 3 and I realised you wouldn't be able to play as a high/sun elf. (Not a blood elf, that's not the same.)

 

Seriously. People have been screaming about the death of WoW since 2006, and even though I feel like it's not as great as it once was, it is alive 13 years after the fact (15 years of total life). That is a long time for a game to run, so people will come and go, and return. I have never understood why people feel the need to talk about it. If the game is dying, there isn't much to be done about it, and if it isn't, you just look dumb.

 

That said, dying games don't get people added to the team, more content, QoL additions, or a plan of near and far future plans.

[Astralporing.1957]

> @"Yannir.4132" said:

> People have been saying WoW is dead for a decade now. Still the most played MMO.

"Dying" doesn't mean "dead already". It's a process, something that takes time. WoW started from so high of a place, and from being so vibrant and full of life, that it does take a lot of time for it to die. Still, it is definitely not in a good form now, and getting worse and worse. A game can live really long on life support if noone's willing to pull the plug.

 

GW2 even in its good days, was never even close to WoW at its heights. And, let's be honest, the good days are now over, and they will not return.

 

Is GW2 dying? Maybe it's not yet at this point, but it's definitely no longer filled with life. And it's clear the devs know that and have resigned themselves to it.

 

[kharmin.7683]

> @"Astralporing.1957" said:

> > @"Yannir.4132" said:

> > People have been saying WoW is dead for a decade now. Still the most played MMO.

> "Dying" doesn't mean "dead already". It's a process, something that takes time. WoW started from so high of a place, and from being so vibrant and full of life, that it does take a lot of time for it to die.

 

To be fair, how much competition did WoW have back then compared to now?

[ZerotheFang.5890]

i have seen dead mmo's i played firefall, and many other flops that became unplayable do to way to many bots or lack of intrest. i been through Phantasy Star online 1 and 2 server shut down trust me gw2 is alive and well and i still love it and come back to it.

[Leo G.4501]

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said:

> > @"Kraljevo.2801" said:

> > Why do you care what other people think and why do you have such gullible friends?

> >

> > You know the game is good, so play it.

>

> The sad truth is that popular opinion does affect business. Especially MMOs. If a lot of people proclaim the game is dead and dying, that would mean people thinking of trying it becomes hesitant - no one wants to get into a game that's going to be taken down "soon". There would be people who leave because they believe the doomsayers, looking for a game that "won't die soon". Etc. Etc. Lower playerbase means lower sales, especially for a F2P/B2P game like GW2 who's primary profit comes in the form of gemstore sales no doubt.

>

> It ends up becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy of sorts. Kind of like the show Firefly. People thought it wouldn't make it despite being good, so folks didn't watch it because they didn't want to get into something and enjoy it just for it to be canceled, and the lack of viewership resulted in it being canceled after one season.

 

So what you're saying is, there is some validity to the rumors that the game is dying. Otherwise, I'd say let the game speak for itself or at the very least not entertain outlandish claims you feel aren't true.

 

That being said, I'm still waiting for them to put in some of the pieces of content I'm interested in. Been crossing my fingers for a while. Come on, Anet. Shake things up, pls.