How do you feel about the potential balance patch? *OLD*

[Tycura.1982]

Did some classes get hit too hard?

Some not enough?

What do you think could be changed or added?

Will it change the meta?

 

I personally think they're kicking scourge while it's down.

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/87353/future-potential-wvw-centric-balance-changes-september-13th-2019#latest

 

THERE IS A NEW BALANCE PATCH RELEASED. THIS THREAD IS OUTDATED BY 9/26/19

[Fortus.6175]

Was a new patch note posted somewhere, or is this the one post about 2 weeks ago?

[Tycura.1982]

> @"Fortus.6175" said:

> Was a new patch note posted somewhere, or is this the one post about 2 weeks ago?

 

The one a few weeks ago.

[Fortus.6175]

Ah, well, I think the change to holo's forge mode #5 was a good start, but did not address their sustain comparable with a healer, while not investing a single point into healing.

I saw another good suggestion about revealing the engi the moment they start casting Prime Light. Prime light has a 60 seconds CD, is **UNBLOCKABLE** and can currently be cast from stealth (which lasts 6 seconds), meaning that at best you can only guess, and any decent engi can press "stow weapon" key to cancel the animation if they see you starting to dodge, meaning that they can recast it again within the duration of those 6 seconds of stealth!

 

I was sad to see eles are being ignored, once again (hello there literally 0 patch notes for eles), Im actually starting to get convinced that they **LITERALLY** forgot /and/or dont care about that class.

 

Overall an underwhelming patch, and the saddest part is that we wont get another patch for another 3-4 moths+, you gotta hand it to the team (whatever is left of it(?)) for being consistent with their glacial patch deliveries, it takes real dedication!

[Tycura.1982]

> @"Fortus.6175" said:

> Ah, well, I think the change to holo's forge mode #5 was a good start, but did not address their sustain comparable with a healer, while not investing a single point into healing.

> I saw another good suggestion about revealing the engi the moment they start casting Prime Light. Prime light has a 60 seconds CD, is **UNBLOCKABLE** and can currently be cast from stealth (which lasts 6 seconds), meaning that at best you can only guess, and any decent engi can press "stow weapon" key to cancel the animation if they see you starting to dodge, meaning that they can recast it again within the duration of those 6 seconds of stealth!

>

> I was sad to see eles are being ignored, once again (hello there literally 0 patch notes for eles), Im actually starting to get convinced that they **LITERALLY** forgot /and/or dont care about that class.

>

> Overall an underwhelming patch, and the saddest part is that we wont get another patch for another 3-4 moths+, you gotta hand it to the team (whatever is left of it(?)) for being consistent with their glacial patch deliveries, it takes real dedication!

 

I don't play much Elementalist what would you change on it? I thought it was in a fairly good spot right now.

[bluri.2653]

I hope they nerf sd condi thief to the ground, which i think they will fail at too :)

[Vagrant.7206]

 

[FtoPScrub.5476]

We don't know how many additional changes there are since they only listed the WvW centric ones, but based on those I think they were far too light on Holo nerfs.

[MyPuppy.8970]

Better not touching ele than nerfing anything randomly so i'd say it's a win-win.

[Jaka.3182]

I feel great about inc balance patch. Last two added scrapper and condi thief to list of broken classes and fixed none. So yea, cant wait

[Stallic.2397]

> @"Tycura.1982" said:

 

> I don't play much Elementalist what would you change on it? I thought it was in a fairly good spot right now.

 

Ele isn't on top but they're in a good spot compared to other classes. That'll be even more dramatic when the nerfs to other classes take effect with the next patch. I'd rather they just leave Ele be.

 

But if I were to change things. I'd want updates/buffs to conjures and staff skills.

 

[Tycura.1982]

> @"Stallic.2397" said:

> > @"Tycura.1982" said:

>

> > I don't play much Elementalist what would you change on it? I thought it was in a fairly good spot right now.

>

> Ele isn't on top but they're in a good spot compared to other classes. That'll be even more dramatic when the nerfs to other classes take effect with the next patch. I'd rather they just leave Ele be.

>

> But if I were to change things. I'd want updates/buffs to conjures and staff skills.

>

 

I'd like to see viable conjures other than FGS. Lightning hammer is aesthetic as hell.

[Fat Disgrace.4275]

Nerf mesmer more

[Math.5123]

Only thing this will accomplish is to effectively remove supports from comps. Nerfing Firebrand won't magically make other supports viable. People will just choose to play 5 dps comps.

 

Also, if they want to nerf fb. Removing Mercy signet would be a good start.

 

Holo will still be insanely strong. The radius decrease on pf5 won't do anything. They need to cut deeper. Heat therapy, combo finishers, cooldowns and kinetic battery/ static discharge interactions with forge.

[Vagrant.7206]

> @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> Holo will still be insanely strong. The radius decrease on pf5 won't do anything. They need to cut deeper. Heat therapy, combo finishers, cooldowns and kinetic battery/ static discharge interactions with forge.

 

* The radius decrease on PF5 is pretty substantial. Remember basic algebra -- A = pi x r^2. In this case r^2 will go from 360,000 in square area to only 90,000 in square area. And because the radius is also vertical, that means a reduction there too. I'm sure somebody less lazy than me can look up the volume calculation. [Oh, Google, you fantastic](https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNRCZUMM0YYABzOdrcEnr0LWQcWKdA%3A1569341293405&ei=bT-KXa6pGNfm-gTs7jE&q=volume+of+a+sphere&oq=volume+of+a+sphere&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39j0l9.1406.2196..2296...0.2..0.81.451.6....3..0....1..gws-wiz.......0i71j0i273j0i20i263.fV7_HttpPWM&ved=0ahUKEwjuk8zy6-nkAhVXs54KHWx3DAAQ4dUDCAs&uact=5 "Oh, Google, you fantastic").

* I'm fine cutting heat therapy. It's pretty OP, because it's a free heal on top of the normal heal.

* Uhh... cutting combo finishers? That hurts everyone, not just engineers. Combos are not the biggest problem.

* Kinetic battery might need some adjustment. Cool with that

* Static discharge is pretty weak right now.

[Megametzler.5729]

Nothing on ele? I was hoping for a change of the glyph to stop spamming it in between fights and towards more DPS. But being ignored is better than nothing, and we're used to it, so...

 

Holo will still be best in slot. I'll ad "remove the jump finisher on PF2" to the list of possibilities. I think stuff like that is what @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" meant.

[Lala.8752]

idea are good but not enough and one more time we have to wait so much time

[OutOfOrder.3719]

They are over- nerfing the shade mechanic again.

 

I don’t know if support Blood Scourge will even be viable anymore. It’s a huge nerf not being able to use skills within range and skills from the area of a shade at the same time.

 

They also failed to properly address Mirage with Chaotic Interruption. I’m probably just going to use Mirage when the patch finally happens.

[Math.5123]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > Holo will still be insanely strong. The radius decrease on pf5 won't do anything. They need to cut deeper. Heat therapy, combo finishers, cooldowns and kinetic battery/ static discharge interactions with forge.

>

> * The radius decrease on PF5 is pretty substantial. Remember basic algebra -- A = pi x r^2. In this case r^2 will go from 360,000 in square area to only 90,000 in square area. And because the radius is also vertical, that means a reduction there too. I'm sure somebody less lazy than me can look up the volume calculation. [Oh, Google, you fantastic](https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNRCZUMM0YYABzOdrcEnr0LWQcWKdA%3A1569341293405&ei=bT-KXa6pGNfm-gTs7jE&q=volume+of+a+sphere&oq=volume+of+a+sphere&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39j0l9.1406.2196..2296...0.2..0.81.451.6....3..0....1..gws-wiz.......0i71j0i273j0i20i263.fV7_HttpPWM&ved=0ahUKEwjuk8zy6-nkAhVXs54KHWx3DAAQ4dUDCAs&uact=5 "Oh, Google, you fantastic").

> * I'm fine cutting heat therapy. It's pretty OP, because it's a free heal on top of the normal heal.

> * Uhh... cutting combo finishers? That hurts everyone, not just engineers. Combos are not the biggest problem.

> * Kinetic battery might need some adjustment. Cool with that

> * Static discharge is pretty weak right now.

 

Like @"Megametzler.5729" said, removing leap finisher from photon leap would be a great start. Or giving it the old ride the lightning treatment, locking it behind a longer cd if used for mobility or if it's getting dodged.

 

Static discharge still gets procced by entering and leaving pf. Pretty sure that's not intended.

[Vagrant.7206]

> @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > > Holo will still be insanely strong. The radius decrease on pf5 won't do anything. They need to cut deeper. Heat therapy, combo finishers, cooldowns and kinetic battery/ static discharge interactions with forge.

> >

> > * The radius decrease on PF5 is pretty substantial. Remember basic algebra -- A = pi x r^2. In this case r^2 will go from 360,000 in square area to only 90,000 in square area. And because the radius is also vertical, that means a reduction there too. I'm sure somebody less lazy than me can look up the volume calculation. [Oh, Google, you fantastic](https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNRCZUMM0YYABzOdrcEnr0LWQcWKdA%3A1569341293405&ei=bT-KXa6pGNfm-gTs7jE&q=volume+of+a+sphere&oq=volume+of+a+sphere&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39j0l9.1406.2196..2296...0.2..0.81.451.6....3..0....1..gws-wiz.......0i71j0i273j0i20i263.fV7_HttpPWM&ved=0ahUKEwjuk8zy6-nkAhVXs54KHWx3DAAQ4dUDCAs&uact=5 "Oh, Google, you fantastic").

> > * I'm fine cutting heat therapy. It's pretty OP, because it's a free heal on top of the normal heal.

> > * Uhh... cutting combo finishers? That hurts everyone, not just engineers. Combos are not the biggest problem.

> > * Kinetic battery might need some adjustment. Cool with that

> > * Static discharge is pretty weak right now.

>

> Like @"Megametzler.5729" said, removing leap finisher from photon leap would be a great start. Or giving it the old ride the lightning treatment, locking it behind a longer cd if used for mobility or if it's getting dodged.

 

But it's quite literally a leap. It's even in the name.

 

Sure, longer CD could be fine, but it should also come with longer swiftness and the CD shouldn't extend longer than 4s. Engineer as a whole lacks gap-closers, and photon forge is a melee kit.

 

> @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> Static discharge still gets procced by entering and leaving pf. Pretty sure that's not intended.

 

It should only proc once for both, that I agree on. But otherwise, it doesn't seem to be unintended.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

good changes, but:

 

holo still too much quickness, sustain, vigor

rev still have too much quickness

spellbreaker still too much sustain + dmg, zerker still broken

ele still a useless bunker that requires healing power

necro still free kill

mes still ridiculous

teef still one shot decapper meme

soulbeast burst still untouched

guard still relegated to support

[otto.5684]

> @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> Only thing this will accomplish is to effectively remove supports from comps. Nerfing Firebrand won't magically make other supports viable. People will just choose to play 5 dps comps.

>

> Also, if they want to nerf fb. Removing Mercy signet would be a good start.

>

> Holo will still be insanely strong. The radius decrease on pf5 won't do anything. They need to cut deeper. Heat therapy, combo finishers, cooldowns and kinetic battery/ static discharge interactions with forge.

 

I would not exactly Call it an FB nerf. All they are doing is removing the aegis from ToC 2. That barely even register on FB support sustainability and it is individual aegis anyway so no impact on support.

 

Holo changes are probably the only good change, and I agree, small, but better than nothing.

 

Everything else was irrelevant. There are probably more changes, but if they did not even make to that list, they unlikely to be of any significance. Overall these changes are semi obsolete.

[Math.5123]

> @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > > @"Vagrant.7206" said:

> > > > @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > > > Holo will still be insanely strong. The radius decrease on pf5 won't do anything. They need to cut deeper. Heat therapy, combo finishers, cooldowns and kinetic battery/ static discharge interactions with forge.

> > >

> > > * The radius decrease on PF5 is pretty substantial. Remember basic algebra -- A = pi x r^2. In this case r^2 will go from 360,000 in square area to only 90,000 in square area. And because the radius is also vertical, that means a reduction there too. I'm sure somebody less lazy than me can look up the volume calculation. [Oh, Google, you fantastic](https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ACYBGNRCZUMM0YYABzOdrcEnr0LWQcWKdA%3A1569341293405&ei=bT-KXa6pGNfm-gTs7jE&q=volume+of+a+sphere&oq=volume+of+a+sphere&gs_l=psy-ab.3..35i39j0l9.1406.2196..2296...0.2..0.81.451.6....3..0....1..gws-wiz.......0i71j0i273j0i20i263.fV7_HttpPWM&ved=0ahUKEwjuk8zy6-nkAhVXs54KHWx3DAAQ4dUDCAs&uact=5 "Oh, Google, you fantastic").

> > > * I'm fine cutting heat therapy. It's pretty OP, because it's a free heal on top of the normal heal.

> > > * Uhh... cutting combo finishers? That hurts everyone, not just engineers. Combos are not the biggest problem.

> > > * Kinetic battery might need some adjustment. Cool with that

> > > * Static discharge is pretty weak right now.

> >

> > Like @"Megametzler.5729" said, removing leap finisher from photon leap would be a great start. Or giving it the old ride the lightning treatment, locking it behind a longer cd if used for mobility or if it's getting dodged.

>

> But it's quite literally a leap. It's even in the name.

>

> Sure, longer CD could be fine, but it should also come with longer swiftness and the CD shouldn't extend longer than 4s. Engineer as a whole lacks gap-closers, and photon forge is a melee kit.

>

> > @"AngelLovesFredrik.6741" said:

> > Static discharge still gets procced by entering and leaving pf. Pretty sure that's not intended.

>

> It should only proc once for both, that I agree on. But otherwise, it doesn't seem to be unintended.

 

With that logic jump shot shouldn't be a leap finisher. It's a jump, not a leap.

Engineers doesn't lack Gap closers, they just opt not to go for them because they don't need it. Jump shot, super speed is already quite good. Rocket boots if you feel like you lack it.

 

And entering/ leaving forge shouldn't count at all. Not once. Call it a trade off. Something Holo lacks right now.

[Dantheman.3589]

> @"bluri.2653" said:

> I hope they nerf sd condi thief to the ground, which i think they will fail at too :)

 

They brought deadly ambition to the ground and it’s still better than mug in every way. Condi thief is gonna be here for a bit longer

[Fortus.6175]

> @"Dantheman.3589" said:

> > @"bluri.2653" said:

> > I hope they nerf sd condi thief to the ground, which i think they will fail at too :)

>

> They brought deadly ambition to the ground and it’s still better than mug in every way. Condi thief is gonna be here for a bit longer

 

It was a step in the right direction, but the problem is the covering conditions really, which is the very same problem that condi mesmers [still] have. Most other condi classes (condi guard, condi ele, condi engi, condi warrior) usually have 1-2 damaging conditions, and maybe 1-2 covering conditions if you equip Sigil of Doom, or have some situational trait that applies some condis when certain skill goes off/parameters are met, usually with a significant ICD.

 

Necro changes have me on the fence. I like that now I dont have to not only avoid their shades, but the necros themselves, who would often throw themselves at people after cornering them with the shades. I will wait and see how that ones plays out. It was certainly a buff to the WvW scourage, which did NOT need any buffs whatsoever....