ZDragon.3046

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"MokahTGS.7850" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > @"Richard Marcinko.5132" said:

> > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > > > > > @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> > > > > > > > > TLDR: it's a problem because people have no patience.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maybe you should read the email that anet sent out saying that you should come play and get your "SKYSCALE TODAY"

> > > > > > > > its a problem because people dont like bing lied too and bamboozled

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > LOL ... yeah OMG ... they are FOOLING people into playing a game they have been playing for years to come experience new content. tragic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > i guess you missed the whole part where you cant do the following statement lol

> > > > >

> > > > > No, i didn't miss it ... I'm just realistic because I play GW2 for more than one day ... therefore it's not a big deal that it takes more than a day to get it. I'm not offended by some minor oversight because I play the game anyways and eventually I will get the mount /shrug

> > > >

> > > > That's great for you that apparently has nothing to do all day but play GW2, some of us have jobs and families and RL so we are unable to sit and play for hours on end, which means I MIGHT be able to get it by Christmas but I'm not holding my breath.

> > >

> > > I have a job and family, etc ... that's why time gating doesn't bother me ... because I know I will be playing over a series of days. Time gating doesn't bother people like us.

> >

> > So do I and I completely disagree with you. Please do not try to speak for everyone with your opinion. Your experience does not equate to my experience.

>

> It's not an opinion. Time gating content benefits players with less time to play because it forces the whole population to spread out their time on the content resulting in everyone playing more like the people with less time to play. That means people with less time to play will be ensured a more populated map.

I only agree with you here when it comes to items or events that generally cause 1 player to gain powerful items and or methods to make lots of gold fore example. Raids/fractals are time gated people cant simply run them over and over again for good ez currency and rewards. To allow this could allow a small niche of players to upset the market and or community as a whole. While this is still not impossible for a small niche number of players to do via super lucky rng its not easy to do.

Imagine what would happen if players could get meta map rewards constantly with no daily limit (this will be an even for a short time ) but think about it if it was all the time do you know how quickly the market would shift and become upset by the imbalance.

Now lets talk mounts

This mount benefits the owner and only the owner, It wont make the owner more gold, it wont give the owner better stats, and it wont make the owner a god in pvp or wvw. It wont move its owner faster than other mounts and while its abilities are unique other mounts still have their own place in their respective skills.

So how is this a benefit....

Oh right it spread it out so the map stays populated longer.... ok fair point but what happens after 5 days map population drops and the same result happens all you did was stall it out slightly. What if the collection for a day or two pretty much requires the player to not even do the events or metas in the map and instead mostly send you out for a wild goose chase. Or it sends you to one of the other maps or around the world looking for other items sure you might be in dragon fall but what if you are not participating in the meta events. I know i was not while i was looking for scales, and eggs i almost blatantly ignored the events. When I could no longer progress i left the map and went to pvp... if a good chunk of people play this way how is this helping maps peek in population for a few hours at reset then fall in the off hours till reset again for the next 5 days after which frustrated players return to their normal methods of play sure they might come back for a meta or two every now and again or to farm loot for gold.

But it litterally does not benfit anyone all that much. All this did is frustrate people who are bothered by it and to ignore the fact that it bothers so many people and act like "Because it does not bother me it should not bother you" is just ignorance at its finest.

> @"Rain.7543" said:

> > @"MokahTGS.7850" said:

> > The OP doesn't understand that there are a lot of people that can only carve out 1 to 2 hours every day. If that block of time doesn't allow you to finish a collection before the reset then you are out of luck for the day. This can easily turn a minimum 5 day time gate into much longer than intended. It artificially punishes people that have shorter play times. This is simply bad design.

> >

> > For example, this time gate might actually stop my wife from playing the game due to an artificially introduced mechanic. It is frustrating, and enough to cause people to stop playing entirely. Pretty sure that was not ANet's intent.

> if getting a mount for say 10 days, instead of 5 is enough to make people stop playing the game, then they are playing the wrong game. I've been long enough around different MMO's ingame communities and forums to say that people usually just want the new shiny thing asap. Atleast many do. That's why we have people burning through content in a day and then they start complaining again they have nothing to do and work towards.

>

> That's why nowadays we have issues of intense development crunch times in a number of games, where the developers are put through insane 100 hours a week work times so they can produce content faster and it's still not enough. Gamers still burn through it all in over a day or a week.

>

> If Anet made the collections possible to complete in a day, people would complain that they have nothing new to work towads, just like people now complain about the time gate. However the design for the collections were made, some people would be happy and other not. Anet decided to go with that design, so you can either accept it or not, but realisticly i don't see them changing it, as this would be no easy task i am sure.

To be fair and im not trying to shame anet...

They had more than enough resources to push this game far beyond what its at right now, and they were not using those resources to do that.. Its clear to me with the updates ive seen in the past few months that this game could have easily had much more to offer players between living world updates. Ever since the lay offs have you noticed anything... perhaps all the extra little events that happening been the previous and the current episode. When was the last time we had unique events between major living world updates that were not halloween, wintersday, and SAB.

Could it be that now more resources are being pooled into gw2?

Could it be that if this type of action had been going on for the past 2 years that we could have been looking at another x pack instead of going into season 5.. possibly but who knows.

The time between HoT and PoF shocked me really I dont think anyone expected the PoF x pack at all. It hit far sooner than anyone thought it would and people loved PoF I know I did. While its maps metas were not up to par with say the HoT metas the content and story were well done. There was plenty to do and the living world started up rather rapidly after PoF it was not until after that first episode or 2 that things started to really slow down where we got long gaps of just nothing... i was there playing them... we would get an episode and then 4-5 months of nothing not even mini events outside of the standard halloween winters day and SAB.

So before you try to play the "Players burn through content to fast card" Ask your self do you think that anet could have possibly provided us with more content via events or other methods as they have been doing more recently, In the past 2-3 months ive seen more none standard mini player events than I can recall in the past year out of the standard ones i listed above.

WvW no down state, Mist rift event, World Boss rush, and they have already announced even more events to come in the future and that more are under planning.... so think really hard before you try to write off the "Gamers burn though it all in a day or week" card, Sometimes more can be done and while living world has never lasted long except in the days of scarlet those were some of the best living world updates gw2 ever had in its history imo, but that method of updates is no longer a thing. Because players who dont play that content in the moment miss out on it completely.

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> > > I'm glad these people never attempted to get legendary armors. That's some real timegate for you.

> > > This... is nothing. I'm sorry.

> > >

> > > Not everything has to be readily available.

> >

> > Mount = item for mobility and fun movement

> > Legendary armor = items that can be used to change your play style at any time with free stat swap and make the player super shiny

> > One is not equally weighted to the other obviously

> >

> > Also at no point has anet labeled this mount as a Legendary (correct me if im wrong) thus one should not be comparing it to legendary items to make the idea of it ok.

> > Any time the term legendary is used in this game its clear cut to any player right out the gate that its going to require a lot of time to obtain it there is no real shock factor in that regard.

> >

> > To time gate a mount like this has induced a big shock to many players because its not been done before with any of the other mounts and it was done with this one for what really is no good reason.

> >

> > I thought i would quit wvw completely when i got the warclaw but i play it more now than I ever have i still dont main it and i dont wvw every day but I will jump into it if im bored its become an alternative option for me away from spvp because of the warclaw.

> >

> > One should not assume just because a player obtains a sky scale quickly that the new map would die. There really is NO REAL reason that this was gated like this

>

> I missed the part of the argument where legendary has anything to do whether or not it should be timegated. Care to explain?

Sure its not a legnedary dont treat it like such unless some one from anet can confirm it is one

> If anything, legendary armor content is already "gated" by the fact that it's hard content, it doesn't need a second gate.

I never said it did i dont think you are understanding me correctly. I was simply point out an example of "What if" and its clear that by you saying its hard content so it does not need a second gate means you dont approve of it.

I said that its well understood that when the word "Legendary" i used in terms of items quality in gw2 that there is an understanding that its going to take significant time to obtain. There is no shock factor because its been the standard for such a long time people know what they are getting to from the start.

When anet says new mount not once have they ver locked people out for them for several days its a "Big!" shock factor that players are not use to myself included and i play daily. I expect any legendary item to take months of work its been the standard from the start but mounts have NEVER been that way. The one mount that should have been that way was griffon and it was not even gated through a method in which the player had 0 control over how fast the could complete it.

> And if there ever was to be a "legendary mount", even just a skin, I am 100% convinced people would complain about not being able to access it right away. A lot of AAA companies know that all too well, hence all the lootboxes we're getting :) Modern gaming is all about instant gratification.

Yeah it is and loot boxes have been a thing forever lets not even try to bring that into this cause thats an entire different discussion.

> The warclaw has a timegate too: 8 hours. Bit less with boosters.

2.5...ish (at least when it came to the reward track) I had all the other task done by the time that got finished so.... not sure what took you 8 hours literally came home the day of release jumped into wvw with a friend it took me about 2.5 hours and took him about 3 hours to completely unlock the base mount neither one of us were were wvw mains. We literally just played listened to commanders it and took one task at a time with other players. Granted at the time anet was running the free 100% bonus you could stack with your boosters.. if it took you 8 hours you were doing things a bit on the slow side i have to say or you tried to obtain it after the event ended.

> 8 hours isn't 5 days. But it's all subjective. To me, a month having to do a repetitive thing every single day is too much, 5 days is nothing. To you, 5 days is too much, 8 hours is nothing.

Once again it didnt take me 8 hours i got it the day it released.

Got the roller the day after it released (only because the map instance to continue the story was bugged for a full day other wise would have gotten it in one day too) I got it the next day with about 2-3 hours worth of collection work most of that time was waiting on the bigger key world bosses to spawn such as mark II golem etc. If you lined the timing up right with the world bosses that you needed to complete the collection you could do it in a day.

>

> Content should always be gated to be somewhat rewarding. Either through gold/currency, difficulty or time.

Once again im not arguing that content should not be gated. Im arguing that the gates should be flexible within reason. IF a player wishes to work hard to obtain something a bit faster although it still might not be instant that should be a thing. Its been a thing with every mount up to this point even Griffion which was the secret mount was not this gated and with some help from friendly players i managed to get it in a single day.

> Timegate is by far my least favorite, but if you're not gonna have that, you need to make the mount either expensive, or gated through difficult content, otherwise it's just like the beetle and won't matter within days of release. Which one do you prefer? Yet another gold sink? We have so many of them already and the gryphon covers that. A gold sink is also a huge time sink, so pick your poison :)

I would gladly pay my own hard earned gold to unlock the mount over waiting 5 days as i have control over working to earn and or save gold and spend it on what i choose as my reward but i dont have control over waiting 24 hours in which progress cannot be made at all. You simply have to wait which is frustrating... as the main feature i was really looking forward too the most its very upsetting to know wont be getting the thing i wanted most from the update for several more days.

Yes I prefer a gold sink because gold can be gained reasonably fast depending on how much gold you are talking if the mount cost 300-500 gold to complete for example but I didnt have to wait 5 days would i do it.. Darn right I would. I worked for that gold. It is my reward to spend it as i see fit.

> Personally I would go with "finish the last boss in hard mode" for the sweet reward, but such an outrageous requirement is no longer allowed in 2019.

I would even prefer this over over wait 5 days as I have the option to improve and work at beating said boss or bring friends to help me who are also unlocking the mount for an epic fight to remember or even help other players with it (that last fight is fun imo)

My whole argument is that this method was by far the worst choice of options that could have been made to gate the mount.

> @"Dondarrion.2748" said:

> "Actual probelm"

>

> It's a game for crying out loud, you'll get your mount over the course of seven days, why this incessant moaning over things taking time, for whatever reason Anet decided.

>

> Maybe this way more people will get the Skyscale at the same time, not just the hardcore who nolifed the new patch for 72 hours non stop at launch.. it would certainly cater to casuals and letting them also get something new more or less "first" too for once.

Thats what zergs and trains are for do you know how often i see commanders and mentors helping casual players unlock mounts and obtain new masteries. PRETTY OFTEN but you know what stops that process a needless 24 hour time gate. Its going to make it a lot harder for people who don't wiz through it in the first 3-5 days to get help with getting it as they could be on a different step from the commander or other players trying to help them.

Overall this was needless yes we will still get the mount but the point of this is that it was literally needless and more of an annoyance than a "good thing"

> @"Deihnyx.6318" said:

> I'm glad these people never attempted to get legendary armors. That's some real timegate for you.

> This... is nothing. I'm sorry.

>

> Not everything has to be readily available.

Mount = item for mobility and fun movement

Legendary armor = items that can be used to change your play style at any time with free stat swap and make the player super shiny

One is not equally weighted to the other obviously

Also at no point has anet labeled this mount as a Legendary (correct me if im wrong) thus one should not be comparing it to legendary items to make the idea of it ok.

Any time the term legendary is used in this game its clear cut to any player right out the gate that its going to require a lot of time to obtain it there is no real shock factor in that regard.

To time gate a mount like this has induced a big shock to many players because its not been done before with any of the other mounts and it was done with this one for what really is no good reason.

I thought i would quit wvw completely when i got the warclaw but i play it more now than I ever have i still dont main it and i dont wvw every day but I will jump into it if im bored its become an alternative option for me away from spvp because of the warclaw.

One should not assume just because a player obtains a sky scale quickly that the new map would die. There really is NO REAL reason that this was gated like this

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > > > > > @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> > > > > > > > > TLDR: it's a problem because people have no patience.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Maybe you should read the email that anet sent out saying that you should come play and get your "SKYSCALE TODAY"

> > > > > > > > its a problem because people dont like bing lied too and bamboozled

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > LOL ... yeah OMG ... they are FOOLING people into playing a game they have been playing for years to come experience new content. tragic.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > i guess you missed the whole part where you cant do the following statement lol

> > > > >

> > > > > No, i didn't miss it ... I'm just realistic because I play GW2 for more than one day ... therefore it's not a big deal that it takes more than a day to get it. I'm not offended by some minor oversight because I play the game anyways and eventually I will get the mount /shrug

> > > >

> > > > Well its objective to different people

> > > > I play generally every day and it bothers me that I can do anything to progress for 24 hours so I pretty much stopped playing the content in that map till the reset happens.

> > >

> > > Then the design of the map is successful ... because Anet want people to do some, come back, etc ... that's why time gating exists. And that's not unreasonable ... because it's not designed so that you get everything done in one day then wonder why we don't have new content more often. It's all related and it's how any MMO works ... somehow you pay. And that somehow is what keeps you coming back and playing.

> >

> > My rebuttal to this is what if people only come back to the map to talk to the npc there is nothing we can see (yet, as far as i know) that is going to require people to come back and play the events and metas.

>

>

> Except there is ... so nothing further to pontificate here. If you can't find something to do in that map for the time needed to get the mount, then you don't deserve it anyways.

You literally could not have read my post with any kind of understanding because none of what you said is what i implied by any means. Please read it again and rebuttal.

> @"Ashen.2907" said:

> > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said:

> > I'm SICK of people crying in map chat and on forums about a FIVE DAY timegate on the new mount. How impatient and entitled can you be?

> >

> > The timegate is going to keep the map populated for longer, people are going to be hyped for longer about getting the new mount - people are having fun figuring out the collection together, it's more of an event, etc. Imagine if we all just got the Skyscale for free at the end of the episode, great, now there's no prestige to it whatsoever, we can all abandon the gorgeous new map, and hover and kitten around in DR/LA. Nice.

> >

> > THE TIMEGATE IS FINE.

>

> If a five day time gate is going to keep the map populated longer than if there was no such time gate, then you are saying that the map and its content are insufficient to keep player interest for more than four days.

>

> Why do you think so poorly of the new map?

but the result after the 5 days is the same as if it was not there in the first place and all you do is frustrate a majority of players for several different reasons..... ideally this was a needly bad choice.

If the map is good people will stay regardless.

Could have made mastery exp scaled up so that it takes days to finish this is ok... too

5 days with hard progress lock is not ok.

> @"TempestMoon.5403" said:

> I am 1000% fine with the timegate. All people seem to want to do anymore is rush through content so they can get that first reaction and then kitten and whine about not having anything to do for the next 3-4 months. Take your time and enjoy the time and effort the devs put in rather than speeding through.

Cant enjoy what you dont own... nuff said

I would like to enjyo that effort they put in with masteries for said mount unlocked.

> @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > @"Marmorix.9654" said:

> > > @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > > > @"Zahme.7802" said:

> > > > > @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > > > > Holy dude, just go through with the 5 days and you're done. People really overexaggerate this - as if you had to climb the K2 without an oxygen flask.

> > > >

> > > > Its not 5 days if you can only play on weekends, then its 21 days ;-)

> > >

> > > Okay granted, but then you'll be 'slow' generally. They simply can't consider every playstyle.

> >

> > For which playstyle is the time gate a benefit?

> > I only see people who doesn't care about it and people who don't like it. But I have never see a response like 'Yeahhhh time gated stufff, cheeerrs'

>

> Well, maybe I am a different kind, but somehow I liked the working towards something-appeal. I made a lot of legendaries though. Maybe I just like it. The feel of reward is bigger when you had to work for it a bit and sorry a 5 days isn't really a long time. For my first legendary in 2012 I grinded for about 3-4 months daily.

As far as this statement goes

I have doubts that your progress is 100% stopped at any point during that 3-4 month grind. Legendaries often require so many complexed items that there is almost always something you can work on until you get down to the last few bits at which point your progress might become locked for a few 24 hour resets. Usually its gemstones, mystic coins, or clovers that do it from my understanding. (maybe a few other items as well depending on what route you took) but nothing stops you from going for general masteries and gifts or saving mats and gold you are still making progress for the majority of that time.

Keep in mind this mount is not marketed as a legendary mount (As far as I could tell feel free to correct me if im wrong) nor is it a secret easter egg mount like the griff was. Even if we want to talk legendaries there were people running around with the new legendary gs within the first hour after the patch dropped because they "worked hard toward it" getting the things needed before the patch hit.

So why cant players who want to "work hard toward" the new mount to get it quickly do that if they want it as one of the main features. So while you may not mind the gating because you make legendaries not everyone is like you and makes or has mad 10 legendaries. Even sooooooooo as noted before there was nothing stopping players from "working hard" to make sure they could obtain the gs on day one of its release. If players had saved everything needed to make the gs only to find out its going to take another 10 or 20 days or more because of some "new unforeseen item for no real reason" I doubt players who were looking forward to getting the new gs would be happy about it while it wouldnt bother everyone it would no doubt bother some because no previous legendary was done that way right?

I obtained the griffon in a day once i saw another player with it just by asking for help with finding eggs in the map chats players were willing to help one another as no guide was up at the time to do it. Saving gold was on me but that was not hard simply sold some things i had been holding onto for ages and ez pz gold gain "I worked hard" saving those things to sell for gold for what ever i wanted in the future and could sell them to obtain a mount quickly.

But no amount of hard work in this particularly instance of gating will allow a player to obtain the new mount more quickly.

> @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > @"Adenin.5973" said:

> > > @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > > > @"Marmorix.9654" said:

> > > > > @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > > > > > @"Zahme.7802" said:

> > > > > > > @"ProtoGunner.4953" said:

> > > > > > > Holy dude, just go through with the 5 days and you're done. People really overexaggerate this - as if you had to climb the K2 without an oxygen flask.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Its not 5 days if you can only play on weekends, then its 21 days ;-)

> > > > >

> > > > > Okay granted, but then you'll be 'slow' generally. They simply can't consider every playstyle.

> > > >

> > > > For which playstyle is the time gate a benefit?

> > > > I only see people who doesn't care about it and people who don't like it. But I have never see a response like 'Yeahhhh time gated stufff, cheeerrs'

> > >

> > > Well, maybe I am a different kind, but somehow I liked the working towards something-appeal. I made a lot of legendaries though. Maybe I just like it. The feel of reward is bigger when you had to work for it a bit and sorry a 5 days isn't really a long time. For my first legendary in 2012 I grinded for about 3-4 months daily.

> >

> > How is waiting for a timer to run out work? How is it making it feel more rewarding?

> > You are talking about grinding daily, that's like the exact opposite of a timegate, which makes many ppl just log off for the day wihtout actually doing any more "work"

>

> It's a step by step goal: do your daily thing, go out, have a beer with your friend, go out with great women/men and enjoy the day. There is more than just the game. You'll get it eventually. Why the hurry? You have the game since 7 years without this mount.

Whoa.... hold on their partner

Some of us spend 8 hours or more (12 hours a day) outside of the house at work and or dealing with family or doing just what you said. Its rather rude to tell someone else that they shouldn't live their life the way they choose to and to do they things they want to do (within reason). Some people you must realize are introverted and don't like being around other people physically in the real world to tell them to go out is like telling someone who loves to be out all the time to stay in and that they go out too much. Some people are nerds (myself included to an extent) and love this game to death and want to get our hands on new content the moment we know about it for some people its the new legendary for others its the mount for some its purely just the story.

Is it good to get out of the house and away from technology, sure it is. Have we been waiting 7 years for this no.... A more accurate statement is something probably closer to 7 weeks. (i cant remember when we got the first glimpse of a skyscale)

No other mount has been like this so why is this one?

Its all just a big shock to a majority of players and the ones who are upset about it are upset with good reason. Had this been done with say roller beetle, and warclaw, in which you were locked out from progress for 24 hours even if you started on the day of the contents release we likely wouldn't be sitting here taking issue with it. Because we would expect that the new main feature of the patch is going to take a few days to get via daily reset but that HAS NOT HAPPENED BEFORE. This is the biggest issue for those who were looking forward to the mount as the main feature on day 1 release as it was ideally marketed.

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > > > @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> > > > > > > TLDR: it's a problem because people have no patience.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Maybe you should read the email that anet sent out saying that you should come play and get your "SKYSCALE TODAY"

> > > > > > its a problem because people dont like bing lied too and bamboozled

> > > > >

> > > > > LOL ... yeah OMG ... they are FOOLING people into playing a game they have been playing for years to come experience new content. tragic.

> > > >

> > > > i guess you missed the whole part where you cant do the following statement lol

> > >

> > > No, i didn't miss it ... I'm just realistic because I play GW2 for more than one day ... therefore it's not a big deal that it takes more than a day to get it. I'm not offended by some minor oversight because I play the game anyways and eventually I will get the mount /shrug

> >

> > Well its objective to different people

> > I play generally every day and it bothers me that I can do anything to progress for 24 hours so I pretty much stopped playing the content in that map till the reset happens.

>

> Then the design of the map is successful ... because Anet want people to do some, come back, etc ... that's why time gating exists. And that's not unreasonable ... because it's not designed so that you get everything done in one day then wonder why we don't have new content more often. It's all related and it's how any MMO works ... somehow you pay. And that somehow is what keeps you coming back and playing.

My rebuttal to this is what if people only come back to the map to talk to the npc there is nothing we can see (yet, as far as i know) that is going to require people to come back and play the events and metas.

As i said gating is ok time gating in this sense is not ok. In fact i know one of the collections requires you to own all of season 4 meaning you will be spending time outside of dragonfall not in it. While no doubt some collections will have you come back and play things in the map its a good chance that somethings also wont do more than require you to go around the map searching or talking to an npc or waiting for specific particular event. This is not truly a way of keeping people.

As you said the map is successful and if this is the case you shouldn't need to feel or entertain the idea of forcing players to return to it via a 5 day time gate. IF anything people will be furious at the end of the time gate and leave it be not wanting to come back after the fact.

Currently the meta rewards are good and not limited so people are enticed by the idea of (good loot farm) to continue playing it as well as its natural fun. But I was holding tons of loot before i started playing the map, I don't particularly need more unidentified gear but sure ill take it why not its not a real factor for me atm. (im sure the loot will get nerfed at some point too which will also ruin some of the maps replay value.)

The argument is not that their should not be any gates the argument is that anet picked a very bad option to use for gating.

If you want to keep people in the map why only do it for 5 days... this also makes no sense. What happens after the 5 days or the first week or 2 when whats likely the common population of players who play every day or every other day finish and deiced (not going back ill go back to normal play now) in which they continue to play the game but wont spend tons of time in that map. You kept the population at a peek for 5 days while frustrating alot of players..... what does this achieve.

Ideally population drop is gonna happen no matter what you cant solve that with a time gate on the main feature of the update and say "well anet does not want you to speed through it"

Ideally anets goal should not be to keep people playing this map for as long as possible it should be to keep people playing in general as long as possible just because you give players a new mount on day 1 does not mean they will stop palying on day 2.... You cant say well "anet wants you to enjoy the content and not blast through it" when you dont have access to the content. :unamused:

Here is way i say it again gates are ok for games but gates should never slow progress by 100%

Lets look at legendaries as an example

When making a legendary there are several gifts and masteries items you need to make

During this process you know you also need to max the required crafting profession based on what you are making

During the process you know you will need to save lots of mats and gold

Even if say you have completed fractals for the day bought your 2 clovers you can still work to finishing masteries and gifts of other types. Other methods don't stop you from collecting or buying mats or saving gold. Generally so much work goes into a legendary that you are always are progressing in some way or fashion even if the overall process takes you a few months your progress is rarely stopped to 0% (granted you know what you are doing)

In the case of roller mount the gates for the collection were world bosses (mostly) I managed to finish it in 1 day (i got lucky with my world boss timing so it took overall 2-3 hours)

In the case of warclaw the gate was mostly the reward track (im not a wvw main) I simply played on borderlands for roughly 2.5 hours and got the base mount unlocked (i still dont have all its masteries but at least im able to enjoy it and use it when i pop into wvw)

These gates above slowed your progress to getting the mounts and didn't allow you to obtain them instantly but never were you fully stopped from making progress for a dead drop long period of time. Even players who cant play very much or every day with some help from friends or other players could make significant progress in their limited time to at least gain the base mounts that released in the past.

This is THE FIRST mount anet has gated through a 24 hour lockdown in which 0% progress can be made toward it this will happen 5 different times and the following 3 or 4 collections that we cant see we have no idea what will be required to complete them. Remember it could even be more than 3-4 collections as the first part was 4 separate collections that completed 1 collection. If the following ones are also like this it could mean that some of them could not reasonable be done within a days time extending that 5 day minimum.

Anet could have gated the mount and i would have been ok so long as i could still progress if I was willing to play and work hard for it. Even if it took me some one who plays every day for several hours days to complete it i would be ok with it (maybe mildly grumpy at most). Ill be lucky to get it by sunday if i complete each required collection per day before reset as it stands right now and im still very upset by it because the mount was probably a solid 70% of the main attraction of this update for me. The story was not bad but it was not good either the fights were actually nice (not over complexed) I would and am going to totally replay them because overall the story had me hype as far as the play through goes. The writing was meh though... i didn't like some key points (i wont name them here) but overall not bad it did feel rushed. I was at least expecting as much story as the previous episode (took 2 hours to play through) i was surprised this one was only an hour and i was not even rushing.

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > > > @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> > > > > TLDR: it's a problem because people have no patience.

> > > >

> > > > Maybe you should read the email that anet sent out saying that you should come play and get your "SKYSCALE TODAY"

> > > > its a problem because people dont like bing lied too and bamboozled

> > >

> > > LOL ... yeah OMG ... they are FOOLING people into playing a game they have been playing for years to come experience new content. tragic.

> >

> > i guess you missed the whole part where you cant do the following statement lol

>

> No, i didn't miss it ... I'm just realistic because I play GW2 for more than one day ... therefore it's not a big deal that it takes more than a day to get it. I'm not offended by some minor oversight because I play the game anyways and eventually I will get the mount /shrug

Well its objective to different people

I play generally every day and it bothers me that I can do anything to progress for 24 hours so I pretty much stopped playing the content in that map till the reset happens. Unless i just want to farm unidentified gear there is no reason for me to stay there, not because of shards or exp simply because my progress is 100% locked to something i cant control no matter how hard i want to work for the new featured mount. (im sure im not the only one who is in this situation)

For others the spirit shards are a big deal, Maybe they use them up quite often and now cant not constantly get them, or perhaps some people simply do not like to waste anything such as exp gain. They have no control around the issue other than to play core or HoT content to not be wasteful or continue to gain spirit shards.

I know will i still get it after a few days. Sure im still going to do it but am i not upset, sorry to say that i am upset by it. I'll probably be one of the lucky people who gets it before the week comes to an end but the sheer disappointment of all that hard work yesterday really hurts and its clearly frustrating to many people. You might think people like me and other are being selfish and or entitled and upset for no reasons and that we should wait happily. Well people like me and others think people like you are insane for not being upset and seeing an issue there is more than one perspective here. Ive seen post here that argue that it is a problem and that its not a problem. So obviously its not an issue for everyone. But I can honestly say the "its a problem post" are certainly more active than the "its not a problem ones are."

If i was some one who took the day off (because i love the game!) to get the new mount knowing i don't have a lot of free time i would be even more upset. As some people have pointed out with their life schedule a collection that does this is going to take them weeks to finish where as the previous mounts would take a single day to get the base or a few days to unlock etc.

Keep in mind that before you say that anet wants you to enjoy the content and not blast through it.

You cant enjoy something you dont own.

Having skyscales around the map to barrow was a good start if anything it was a great idea on anets part but what they can do seemingly without masteries is very limited and in most spots you have to climb to reach them. I would like to enjoy a skyscale outside of dragon fall ;) Just because you earn something quickly does not mean you stop enjoying it right away.

Anet knows season 5 is a long way off and thats why they are preparing events in the mean time to keep players interested such as the boss rush event and the upcoming event that removes the daily cap on meta events. Things like this should be things that keep players engaged during the down times between seasons not saying come get "this thing" today "we mean 5 days from now"

> @"TheNecrosanct.4028" said:

> I don't get why people avoid PoF maps now. I mean, yes, I get it, but I don't understand people don't realize this will only extend the duration of the problem. Unless they're hoping for a "fix", one that might not even come, because this might be exactly how ANet planned it. There are still loads of people in Dragonfall so it's not going to send a message to ANet by way of population numbers either.

>

> The whole "I want it all and I want it now" attitude is not helping people. There really is no need, and what's a few days in a lifetime? Not getting spirit shards is not going to create insurmountable problems. Whatever you're using them for will have to wait a bit. I don't see anything that will impede gameplay by not getting spirit shards. Is it ideal? No. But the longer you wait, the longer the problem will persist.

Its the idea that its wasteful really for players who already have all PoF masteries.

Story completion xp wasted, map meta and event xp wasted, progress toward new mount and its masteries non existent for another 24 hours, 5 days, (for players who have busy lives and have limited play time possibly several weeks)

Anet could hide the mastery and return spirit shard gain yes but over all with this mount being treated like a legendary mount when it was not announced as such or hidden as such it creates a problem for people in the general public who were looking forward to it over the other key features.

On top of that your are forced to complete the story to even attempt to start progress unlike roller.

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> > > TLDR: it's a problem because people have no patience.

> >

> > Maybe you should read the email that anet sent out saying that you should come play and get your "SKYSCALE TODAY"

> > its a problem because people dont like bing lied too and bamboozled

>

> LOL ... yeah OMG ... they are FOOLING people into playing a game they have been playing for years to come experience new content. tragic.

i guess you missed the whole part where you cant do the following statement lol

> @"Blocki.4931" said:

> > @"bOTEB.1573" said:

> > What exactly we can't get on the very 1st day? (all i did yesterday was the full story + map completion)

> > Just curious, haven't started the collection yet.

>

> After the first two collections for the Skyscale you have to wait a day between finishing the following ones. People are mad they don't get worthless spirit shards.

first 4 collections

Scales

Medicine (will require you to play several map metas worth of play time to unlock 3 of them) not an issue cause the map is actually fun to play but still.

Find sick ones

Eggs

Wait a day

next unknown collection (don't know the task or if it will have gold cost)

This repeats the process for a minimum of 5 days assuming you get each collection done fully before the next reset which obviously many people wont because they dont have time to play like that.

People are mad because they spent more time than it took to roughly get roller and griffon combined and dont even have the base mount unlocked yet when anet pretty much has been screaming come get it on release day.

> @"Klowdy.3126" said:

> TLDR: it's a problem because people have no patience.

Maybe you should read the email that anet sent out saying that you should come play and get your "SKYSCALE TODAY"

its a problem because people dont like bing lied too and bamboozled

> @"Marmorix.9654" said:

> > @"ProverbsofHell.2307" said:

> > I'm SICK of people crying in map chat and on forums about a FIVE DAY timegate on the new mount. How impatient and entitled can you be?

> >

> > The timegate is going to keep the map populated for longer, people are going to be hyped for longer about getting the new mount - people are having fun figuring out the collection together, it's more of an event, etc. Imagine if we all just got the Skyscale for free at the end of the episode, great, now there's no prestige to it whatsoever, we can all abandon the gorgeous new map, and hover and kitten around in DR/LA. Nice.

> >

> > THE TIMEGATE IS FINE.

>

> If the map is just populated because of the time gate then the map is very bad designed. It should be populated because the map is good and fun to play ;-)

I do think the map is fun to play actually which is why the gating should have been worked in through completing objectives and events in the map possibly only a certain currency comes from events in certain areas and the meta in general or the bosses after the meta and you need a great deal of said different currencies or collectables from the things i just listed which will take an average player several days to do and an aggressive player a day or two at most to do.

This is one of the best designed maps anet has done imo as it incorporates HoT and PoF masteries the events and meta are based on player progress and activity (they can be triggered some what faster than other map metas. The rewards are not locked per day (as of yet im sure they will be in the future)

So the question is why is their a time gate after a 1 hour story play through and 3-5 hour collection process. in which you still don't have a base mount or cant even earn xp toward the new mount.

Griffion 250 gold 2-3 hours worth of collection work with some help from friends, can be done in 1 day

Roller almost no gold cost 2-3 hours worth of collection work if you get boss times down right with some help from friends can be done in 1 day at most 2 days

Warclaw (from some one who was not a wvw main) 2-4 hours of work, took me about 2.5 hours to get the base mount thanks to the event that was running at the time, could be done in 1 day at the time of its release the only thing that really held people back were q times which is a separate issue. Now can still prob be done in a day but you need help from some good wvw mains and boosters 2 days at most if you really want the base mount unlock.

Skyscale

Requires over 4 hours collection work + story completion time (about 1 hour) just to get the first part of the collection done

5 additional days (of which your progress hits a 100% dead stop)

Unknown collections

What could also be an unknown gold cost too.

As a main feature of the living world's contents release this should not be a thing. Something like this is what you should expect for a hidden easter egg style mount like griffon not a main feature mount like skyscale. THATS SOMETHING THAT REALLY BITES AT ME.

Then the skyscale should have been a hidden easter egg mount almost like griff... oh wait.. griff can be done in a single day and nothing stops you from saving a x amount of gold per day infact I can almost promise you in 2019 it does not take you 5 days or more to get 250g you can prob get it in a day or 2 if you really farm hard and know what to do to get it. I prob have 200-400g in just junk look and mats sitting on my toons right now cause im a hoarder of such things.

Overall time gating is fine but it should never be done in a way that 100% haults progress completely players who are willing to push hard to get it faster should be rewarded for doing such.

They could have said collect x amount of various items from meta events in the different PoF maps or bounty events in different living world season 4 maps and used that as a time gate and it would have been ok because progress is not likely to reach a 100% dead stop you know that you can keep playing and keep making progress. But hitting dead stops is never an ok way to time gate.

also as some people pointed out they cant play consistently everyday so a 5 day gate like this turns into a few weeks for them.

> @"Cristalyan.5728" said:

> > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > > @"Trise.2865" said:

> > > How many times do we have to tell people not to blast through content in 10 minutes? to take their time and enjoy it? They never learn...

> >

> > The thing about that is anet sells the living world updates on new features and content

> > Story

> > (in this case) a Mount

> > A Map

> >~~ The legendary weapon ~~

> > (some times) a raid or fractal

> >

> >

> They already sold the Legendary weapon. Almost 4 years ago. And they already took our money for it. How can you forget this? This weapon **does not belong to this LS episode**. It is a HoT weapon. The good part is that we can say that now HoT is a complete result. (I was close to say it is a **finished** result).

Even if you want to look at it like that i saw several people running around with the GS before I could even finish the living story and I started the living story the moment the patch dropped. Why is that a thing regardless.. imagine if anet had changed something you have to buy for the this gs and limited it to 5 per day and said you needed 100 of them for this particularly legendary but not done it for the others in the past. How would those players feel who have been unlocking legendaries on day one knowing they saved the items needed only to be gated through daily reset. It wouldn't be very appealing to players who were looking forward the most getting the new legendary would it.

ITs the fact that they have never done this with a mount before. They chose to change something thats not been a thing with any mount in the past really or so far and thats whats causing the frustration. I dont even care that it has more collections to do people who want the mount will do them but no one likes to sit around and wait. Of all the ways they could have choosen to buy more time and make this content last longer this was probably one of the worst ways to do it.

I have a email right now promoting the skysacle as main feature to "come play the living world" and you cant event unlock its base in the same day or start working on its masteries etc for several days. Its already taken me and several other friends and people more time to do the first collection than it took to complete roller and griffon almost combined.

We did this only to find out we are no where near finished and cant even progress in any way until a 24 hour reset which will happen several days in a row. Not a good feeling for the majority. I know there are some people who are super passive/ easy going who will have the "I dont mind waiting" attitude but for those were were really looking forward to the mount as one of the main feature updates of this patch its very disappointing i would think.

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> I think it's funny someone complains about the time gate ... I guess spending 250G is more to your liking?

250 g is not that much for an average player and even if you want to put that as a gating feature there is not a cap on the amount of gold youcan get in single day thus progress toward it is never truly stopped at any time... you are missing the point.

> @"Tora.7214" said:

> i honestly cant understand whats the hurry, we are used to farming for months for the good stuff (ascended/legendaries, etc) so whats a few days for a mount?. me personally im gonna wait for someone to release a guide (because aparently Dulfy isnt doing guides anymore) before starting to farm it because im not fan of treasure hunting

Well ascended and legendary gear are generally marketed as such and the expectation of time gated is rationalized within most players heads. Even if some one did not have per say legendary gear but was working on it the time gate in most cases does not stop their progress 100% to a dead stop as many many things are required to complete a ascended or legendary gear.

The mount as far as we know is not an ascended mount or legendary mount it was not marketed as such and infact was shown to us pretty early on in the story. If any mount should have been this annoying to unlock it should have been the griffion as it was literally a hidden easter egg mount that acts as a super glider. And to some people that was much less work than what this requires simply due to the time out that haults all progress.

Not saying people still wont do it but it certainly not a good feeling to get 2-3 hours into the first part of the collection and realize

- you didnt unlock the base mount

- you have more collections to do

- you cant progress those collections till the next day

- even once you finish the next one you will hit another dead stop

Overall it was just a bad choice of how to gate player progress. I get they dont want people to finish the content too fast because this is the final episode of season 4 and season 5 is likely some time away from being ready but of all things to do this with the mount really....

Sometimes dulfy can take a while to post a guide for new coronet even more so when she wants the guides to be highly detailed and well written and easy to follow that takes time to do. In this case it might take several days to do a full guide and then its the matter of if they want to post it in parts or just one full section if one full section you may not see a guide till next week at the moment the earliest some one can get a full base skyscale is sat.

> @"Trise.2865" said:

> How many times do we have to tell people not to blast through content in 10 minutes? to take their time and enjoy it? They never learn...

The thing about that is anet sells the living world updates on new features and content

Story

(in this case) a Mount

A Map

The legendary weapon

(some times) a raid or fractal

The issue is that you when these things were marketed in the past they could all be reasonably accessed within the same day if not 2 days at MOST

So why is the one of the main winning point of this update hard locked to such a long span of time of which you CANT ENJOY IT.

All anet did here is likely for the majority cause frustration and annoyance

If you want something to require a bit of extra work thats fine but to time gate it through daily resets is not a good idea. Never before has anet done this with amount that was exposed as a new feature (not counting griff here even if i was it could be done in a day, a few hours, provided some one was helping you do it) all of which could be gained in the same day if not 2nd day of its release.

Ive already seen people running around with the new legendary GS because they saved mats for it etc. Why is that allowed as a thing yet (its also a main feature of the new update) players cant work for the new mount to get it on day of or 2nd, 3rd, 4th day after its release. Sorry but this was bad decision making at its finest this time.

I think its a big shock because anet has never done this before with a mount. In fact they teased us about it several times and i wont be surprised if i have an email promoting it in the next day or two as one of the main features of the living world. I HOPE THEY NEVER EVER do this kind of bamboozle again without obvious warning.

If they wanted people to enjoy they content they should have found other ways to time gate it that still allow you to progress via playing even if it still takes afew days to complete its not a dead stop in progress and allows people who really want it to go hard for it and get it a bit faster than normal means.

They could have done that through

- Mount mastery xp itself

- Rewards from bounties or map metas which can only happy every so often but they are bound to keep happening if people keep playing.

Doing it through daily rest just makes me want to close the game and stop till tomorrow thats not truly enjoying content.

That said the map was done well and the events are nice but this is a big kick between the legs. The mount was one of the main things i was looking forward too getting and that wont be for a few days then after that you still need to xp mastery grind to complete it.

> @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> It's radius attack now goes threw wall's with massive op damage that can't be blocked or evaded. Damage goes threw no matter what & you die.

> It need's to be fixed.

What about every other aoe attack that can hit through walls in the game are all those op too?

> @"Xaylin.1860" said:

> > @"ZDragon.3046" said:

> > if you are talking about making trade offs why are you giving new skills to core ????

> >

> > Here is how you do it.

> >

> > - No new f5 skill for core

> > - Chrono looses 4f in exchange for f5 (the time splitter skill gets a cd reduction as a result)

> > - Mirage keeps f4 from core but now has a lower clone cap of 1 or 2 clones with the clone/ clones having increased hp or

> >

> >

>

> If anything, Mirage should get a malus on Phantasm-damage.

> Mirage is a clone spec so reducing the number would be weird.

Maybe you could be right here.

To be honest I always felt that ambush attacks should happen for mirage clones by default (but they don't evade attacks when you do) infinite horizon should probably not exists in exchange for something else.

>

> @"viquing.8254" said:

> > Never forget that core was cut from a third of his gameplay while they removed on death traits, that were used even with no blackwater in the so skilled-lol-shatter-bursts builds.

>

> And I'd never want to see them return, seriously... However, it is indeed problematic that Mirage checks so many boxes on what baseline Mesmer should be good at to begin with. Chrono is just a balancing nightmare because of CS. The only way I could see baseline Mesmer becoming better at power burst is if Chrono had some damage penalties (being it by default or when using CS).

>

I wonder if the reason core Mesmer does not check the boxes that mirage does is because at the time they didnt have the tools and ideas to make mirage do what it does today or they were worried that it would be too strong in relation to other other professions. I mean if you think back to how the game use to be with core professions. If mirage exsisted back then ohh boy.... its possible they could have just limited mesmer down on purpose to keep it in check.