DirectX 9

[hanifemelissaiklimirmak.36]

Almost 8 years, but still there is no development of the game engine directX 9'da why this is not so insistent or this will continue to be done in the future, or even if the development of very robust computers sometimes becomes desperate. unfortunately, everyone's computer is not the last System drop and taklamaların as soon as possible with the wish to eliminate

[Ayrilana.1396]

It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

[hanifemelissaiklimirmak.36]

with a game running with d11, there's an obvious 20 to 25 fps difference.

 

[hanifemelissaiklimirmak.36]

and now I'm getting tired of client errors and connection problems.

[Mack.3045]

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

 

That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

[Mack.3045]

> @"hanifemelissaiklimirmak.3621" said:

> Almost 8 years, but still there is no development of the game engine directX 9'da why this is not so insistent or this will continue to be done in the future, or even if the development of very robust computers sometimes becomes desperate. unfortunately, everyone's computer is not the last System drop and taklamaların as soon as possible with the wish to eliminate

 

I would recommend you try the D912pxy, this will allow you to run the game in Direct X 12.

 

Let me know how you go :)

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

[Ayrilana.1396]

> @"Mack.3045" said:

> > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

>

> That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

 

You're not running the game in DX12.

[Mack.3045]

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> >

> > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

>

> You're not running the game in DX12.

 

I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

 

https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

 

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

 

 

 

 

[Ayrilana.1396]

> @"Mack.3045" said:

> > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> > >

> > > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

> >

> > You're not running the game in DX12.

>

> I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

>

> https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

>

> https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

>

>

>

>

 

That's not DX12.

 

EDIT:

 

>I feel like I may be able to clear up some things here.

 

>>GW2 stays on DX9 and 32bit client which kinda.. lags a lot, and sometimes even crashes on huge battles/worldbosses (i see you Tequatl).

 

>For the vast majority of players, the lag is unrelated to both of these.

 

>All software have a thing called threads. You can think of each thread as a highway lane: They run in parallel, and they each perform different tasks simultaneously. They are what applications use to scale with multiple cores on CPUs, as each thread can only run on one CPU core at a time.

 

>Each application has a thread known as the main thread. For games that thread is usually the thread that's in the driver's seat of the frame. It determines what to process and when on a higher level, such as "process OS messages", "update the game state", "process animations", "send state to the render thread", etc. All the different things that go into a game frame. The majority of game engines do some of these on a different thread, but in many cases the main thread still determines when it should happen.

 

>So since threads are useful for scaling things, you'd think that you could simply create more threads and get more work done. But while it's true that you have more computing power with more threads, threads also have downsides. For one, you cannot modify data in memory while another thread is reading that same data. In order to do this one thread has to wait for the other to stop using the data, meaning work is done in serial even if the code itself is running on multiple threads. To make matters worse, the OS is not guaranteed to put a thread back to work the very moment the other thread has finished. It can actually take a long-ish time (long being a very relative term). Due to this, software engineers are forced to properly design their applications to work well in parallel. Doing this after the fact is usually on the range of non-trivial to very hard.

 

>Which brings us to GW2. GW2 does a lot of processing, and much of it is done on the main thread. That is also where its bottleneck tends to be: The main thread. There are conscious efforts in moving things off the main thread and onto other threads (every now and then a patch goes out that does just this), but due to how multi-threading works it's a non-trivial thing that take a lot of effort to do. In a perfect world, we could say "Hey main thread, give the other threads some stuff to do if you're too busy", but sadly this is not that world.

 

>As for DX9 and 32bit: Moving off of DX9 wouldn't buy us a whole lot performance wise, as all interaction with DirectX is happening on the render thread, which is generally not the bottleneck. Moving from 32-bit to 64-bit also does not really buy us a lot performance-wise. There are some optimizations the compiler is able to do with 64-bit that it can't do otherwise, but the actual FPS gain is minimal at best.

 

>And about crashing on Tequatl: Here's one case where a 64-bit client could actually help. Many of the crashes happening on Tequatl (which are still quite few, mind you) are cause of memory fragmentation. The bigger memory address space of 64-bit apps could help prevent that. This becomes more of a problem the longer you keep your client running.

 

>>I have intel i3, my friend got i7, which is waaaaaaaaaaaay better than mine. Guess who get more screen spikes? i7. Yes.

 

>Without knowing more of your systems (and what software is running simultaneously to GW2) I really can't even guess the cause of this. All things equal it should not be the case (though I'm not saying that it isn't).

 

>>Oh, and also i heard that GW2 tends to use CPU, not GPU. What the..? :x

 

>The CPU and GPU are good at different things. There's no such thing going on as us using the CPU rather than the GPU. We use both, for the different things they're good at. In simple terms, the GPU just happens to finish its work before the CPU does, causing it to wait for the CPU to catch up.

 

[Mack.3045]

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> > > >

> > > > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

> > >

> > > You're not running the game in DX12.

> >

> > I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

> >

> > https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

> >

> > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

> That's not DX12.

 

I'm not sure if you're outright trolling or not. I suggest you read what the D912pxy does.

Edit, despite what the development team said initially regarding running the game in Dx12 or another API the D912pxy does increase performance.

If you would like feedback from the user-base you can join the GW2 development user channel in discord. There are some Anet moderators in the discord channel who use the D912pxy themselves :)

 

[Ayrilana.1396]

> @"Mack.3045" said:

> > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> > > > >

> > > > > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

> > > >

> > > > You're not running the game in DX12.

> > >

> > > I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

> > >

> > > https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

> > >

> > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> >

> > That's not DX12.

>

> I'm not sure if you're outright trolling or not. I suggest you read what the D912pxy does.

 

I've read what it does but that doesn't mean it's DX12.

 

Edit:

 

Just to add clarification to my post, I was saying that using a mod that converts some DX9 calls to DX12 calls doesn’t mean that the game is running in DX12. It’s more of a pseudo-DX12 to the extent of the calls contained in the mod and the extent that they can function using the method its developer used.

 

DX12 isn’t going to be a miracle cure for performance issues versus optimizing the game.

 

I’ll also point out that I’ve tried different versions over the past year and none have really improved the performance of my PC.

[Mack.3045]

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

> > > > >

> > > > > You're not running the game in DX12.

> > > >

> > > > I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

> > > >

> > > > https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

> > > >

> > > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > That's not DX12.

> >

> > I'm not sure if you're outright trolling or not. I suggest you read what the D912pxy does.

>

> I've read what it does but that doesn't mean it's DX12.

 

I'm not going to argue with you as iv'e better things to do.

 

I'll let people who read the guide and think critically for themselves make their own mind up. Chau !

 

 

[Mack.3045]

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

> > > > >

> > > > > You're not running the game in DX12.

> > > >

> > > > I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

> > > >

> > > > https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

> > > >

> > > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > That's not DX12.

> >

> > I'm not sure if you're outright trolling or not. I suggest you read what the D912pxy does.

>

> I've read what it does but that doesn't mean it's DX12.

 

Whilst you're at it, you best break the news to all the Linux users using DXVK that it's not using Vulkan either !!!!

 

Both the D912pxy and DXVK perform the same task with their respective API's . Having said that, DXVK is built for compatibility rather than outright performance .

[Super Hayes.6890]

Are there settings I can adjust that improve performance in most cases? I haven't tried that DX12 thing yet but I did drop the character limit and character quality. That helped a bit but not enough. Everything else is maxed atm. What items are the best to adjust down to take some of the load off the main thread? Or is there a guide on the forums someone can point me too for increasing performance? I really don't like running in performance mode since I have a descent system.

[Hannelore.8153]

> @"Super Hayes.6890" said:

> Are there settings I can adjust that improve performance in most cases? I haven't tried that DX12 thing yet but I did drop the character limit and character quality. That helped a bit but not enough. Everything else is maxed atm. What items are the best to adjust down to take some of the load off the main thread? Or is there a guide on the forums someone can point me too for increasing performance? I really don't like running in performance mode since I have a descent system.

 

Only those two settings really matter on a decent system. The rest are GPU-bound and unlikely to be of any consequence unless your computer is a cheap laptop. Character Model Limit should be Lowest and Character Model Quality should be Low.

 

@ Thread:

Keep in mind modern video cards don't accelerate D3D9 very well, or at all. Try dx12pxy or DXVK before complaining. Yes, DirectX 9 has its limitations but for the most part what's happening to the game in recent years isn't the devs fault. Its because the people who develop hardware and software for graphics acceleration don't like wasting money supporting older APIs like they used to.

 

Older games still run on modern hardware but often not very good. Whereas when the game was released all video cards and drivers were super heavily optimised for D3D9 games due to games like StarCraft II being on the market.

 

Plus, the game was designed in an era when a single core processor was still the consumer standard.

 

You're always going to need some level of emulation with older software. Its just how it is. The devs can't just go and waste a ton of resources rewriting the game engine every few years to keep up. You already have the tools to make it work yourself.

[TinkTinkPOOF.9201]

The reason it's DX9 is because when first developed, they decided to stick with the old GW1 game engine and mod it for GW2, as the game engine was an in house engine, meaning no license fees etc. Down side is that it was based on a EoL API, as DX 11 was already out at this time. Another plus for them was that talent already on hand would not need to learn a new game engine and lots of assets already on hand could be used, add into that early on they had the idea they were also going to port to xbox, and xbox at the time used a modified version of DX9, so porting over would again be easier. What they didn't understand is the amount of work that would have been needed for the game on xbox to meet performance metrics, as consoles have minimum performance requirements for games to be published to the platform, and considering MMO's have never been popular on consoles, they probably realized they would never see a ROI for the work needed to push it out on xbox, so the team working on it was disbanded.

 

Why it's not done now is because it's an in house engine, meaning to get DX12 out of it means not only reworking the game for DX12, but also rebuilding the whole game engine. I mean at this point we are talking significant investment for an aging game. Which probably wont bring fresh people in, though might make some people already playing happy, if it's not bringing new players, they are not going to care that much. Also, even out of existing players, how many have DX12 capable GPUs? A large portion of players, at least larger than many people seem to think, play the game with minimum level HW specs if not under specced, many people not even having a dedicated GPU and many who do, are extremely old, well before DX12 support.

 

I would love to see DX12 come to the game, but thats something you are only going to see in GW3, if such a game ever launches.

 

 

[Bish.8627]

> @"Mack.3045" said:

> > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > You're not running the game in DX12.

> > > > >

> > > > > I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

> > > > >

> > > > > https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

> > > > >

> > > > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > > That's not DX12.

> > >

> > > I'm not sure if you're outright trolling or not. I suggest you read what the D912pxy does.

> >

> > I've read what it does but that doesn't mean it's DX12.

>

> Whilst you're at it, you best break the news to all the Linux users using DXVK that it's not using Vulkan either !!!!

>

> Both the D912pxy and DXVK perform the same task with their respective API's . Having said that, DXVK is built for compatibility rather than outright performance .

 

Regardless who is right, I get a much much better experience with D912pxy. Apart from the odd update that breaks it, happened twice, Even Tequatl is smooth for me.

[maddoctor.2738]

> @"Super Hayes.6890" said:

> Are there settings I can adjust that improve performance in most cases? I haven't tried that DX12 thing yet but I did drop the character limit and character quality. That helped a bit but not enough. Everything else is maxed atm. What items are the best to adjust down to take some of the load off the main thread? Or is there a guide on the forums someone can point me too for increasing performance? I really don't like running in performance mode since I have a descent system.

 

Basically to avoid the main thread slow down issue you must use it as little as possible. In simple terms, what limits the main thread is how many items need to be drawn on your screen. The more items that need to be drawn, the more the main thread needs to work. Then it's up to the GPU to render those items.

 

Character limit affects how many characters appear on screen, so it's one of the most important graphic options to improve performance.

LOD distance is another setting that affects performance, similarly to character limit, but it reduces the details in the environment.

Character shadows is another setting that can drastically affect draw calls, it's more visible at higher character limit settings though. Sometimes you might be able to play at reasonable levels with medium character limit settings, but low shadow settings.

Reflections are done poorly in Guild Wars 2, so they can also affect performance, especially in areas with lots of reflective surfaces. Play Serpent's Ire with reflections on and off and you should notice a big difference. The game needs to render all players twice while fighting the last boss due to the "branded" terrain

 

Finally the most obvious performance destroyer, resolution. Try lower settings and/or sub-sampling to get better performance.

[Super Hayes.6890]

Thank you for those replies! Super helpful and informative ?

[Mack.3045]

> @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > @"Mack.3045" said:

> > > > > > > @"Ayrilana.1396" said:

> > > > > > > It’s because upgrading to a new DX version won’t solve anything.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > That's incorrect. Running the game in DX12 gives a big performance boost in most scenarios. This is dependant on individual hardware set-ups.

> > > > >

> > > > > You're not running the game in DX12.

> > > >

> > > > I'm using the D912pxy and have been since it's release. So, yes, I am :)

> > > >

> > > > https://github.com/megai2/d912pxy

> > > >

> > > > https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/110553/want-to-use-directx-12-dx12-for-gw2-heres-a-guide-on-using-the-d912pxy-on-windows-10#latest

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > That's not DX12.

> >

> > I'm not sure if you're outright trolling or not. I suggest you read what the D912pxy does.

>

> I've read what it does but that doesn't mean it's DX12.

>

> Edit:

>

> Just to add clarification to my post, I was saying that using a mod that converts some DX9 calls to DX12 calls doesn’t mean that the game is running in DX12. It’s more of a pseudo-DX12 to the extent of the calls contained in the mod and the extent that they can function using the method its developer used.

>

> DX12 isn’t going to be a miracle cure for performance issues versus optimizing the game.

>

> I’ll also point out that I’ve tried different versions over the past year and none have really improved the performance of my PC.

 

That's the point,there is no pseudo-DX12. The game **IS** running in DX12 when using the D912pxy. The same goes with DXVK, there is no pseudo Vulkan. Those games **ARE** running with the Vulkan API.

 

The reason i'm posting this is so people can read _the correct information regarding the D912pxy and to point them in the direction for more information, rather than your subjective interpretation of what it does_

 

If you want verification you can speak with Megai the developer in Discord. One of the Anet programmers//engineer's is also in the channel and is a moderator there and i'm sure he'd be happy to to chat with you as well.

 

That's fair enough, if it hasn't improved your experience, it's likely due to your system already being CPU/GPU bound using the native DX9 api the game uses.

[phokus.8934]

The game doesn’t run DX12 with d912pxy. It still runs DX9 as dictated by the game engine. The only thing d912pxy does is translates some dx9 functions into dx12.

 

This is merely semantics but if you use this mod you’re still running GW2 with dx9.

[zealex.9410]

I dont get how the notion that dx12 and vulkan by assotiation wont do anything for the game came to be, multiple other titles have introduced either dx 12 or vulkan in recent memory and the results have been noticable if not substantial.

 

For an 8 year old game its vital that it keeps pace with hardware advances and optimises for such advances.

 

It feels like anet dont even care about the game being playable at times.

[coso.9173]

i wonder why people who don't even work for ANET have managed to do this, and the people who work in there don't do a similar thing, if it improves the game substantially.

[Lord of the Fire.6870]

> @"phokus.8934" said:

> The game doesn’t run DX12 with d912pxy. It still runs DX9 as dictated by the game engine. The only thing d912pxy does is translates some dx9 functions into dx12.

>

> This is merely semantics but if you use this mod you’re still running GW2 with dx9.

 

I think you confuse everybody. D912pxy doesn't do anything to the game engine directly it change the calls to form DX9 to DX12 like you said but this means the engine use then DX12 effectively. This what people mean with d912pxy makes GW2 use DX12

 

What also mentionable is the call of the gw 2 engine return immediately they are only written in a worker thread what makes the whole game more responsive on overload situations.

[maddoctor.2738]

> @"coso.9173" said:

> i wonder why people who don't even work for ANET have managed to do this, and the people who work in there don't do a similar thing, if it improves the game substantially.

 

Because the game (core and heart of thorns) still lists Windows XP SP3 as the minimum requirement. The developers have always been reluctant towards upgrading the core game in any way, that goes for graphics too. Now it's either because they have the hardware data and there are a lot of players using potatoes to run this game, the team doesn't want to mess with existing engine code and instead pile new things on top of it, or simply they don't see any engine improvements as a worthwhile investment.