pvp is so dead and lack of content

[felix.2386]

balance could be better, but it's so dead.

mostly for the lack of content and everything being automated, without proper rewards to spend on all the ascended shards

( literally using them to gear up for contents other then pvp at the moment and it drives even the old players out)

or achievements grind,

or skill point grind,

or skin grind

or gift of battle grind

like the wvw/pve has.

 

why pvp so dead? only 1% of the hardcore players stick because they played pvp for so long for literally nothing other then automated tournaments.

pvp need stuff to make new player stick and grind so they can be better and eventually the skill gap will be reduced.

at this point, wvw has more player and is more fun.

 

this is coming from a player who played pvp since 2013 and only has 300 player kill in wvw(got like half of the kills this month)

[Jekkt.6045]

i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

 

not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

 

the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

Well if everyone quit logging in it would force the devs to actually react but everyone complains than logs in anyways. A lot of great games out there.

[felix.2386]

> @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

>

> not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

>

> the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

 

back then you had these.

pvp level was something of prestige, which is why finishers were prestigious for the dedicated

 

and glory's reward is also tied to pvp level, i remember getting majestic sword or seeing phoenix player wearing runic blade and made me grind more

 

and winning match had RNG rare pvp skin drops which also made me grind a ton

 

which will all keep players, new players stick.

 

now level has nothing related to it, other then finisher which finishes at 80 and easy to get with exp nerf with no point going over 80

i found myself playing way less pvp after HoT, not only for the poor balance HoT introduced, also for the lack of reward for the dedicated

 

you can't really single out fractal like a single content like pvp/wvw, it is part of pve.

even so wvw didn't get lot content, but it's still more content then pvp.

as tokens are actually worth using to perfect gears and infusions, and their achievements are actually long term grind

and i find myself grinding wvw level because i need the reward increase and i need the wvw skills.

and has gift of battle which forces player from other content to wvw.

there's nothing that forces other players to pvp and most reward are very short term based and pvp level literally means nothing.

 

right now there's 0 incentive for players to keep playing, the reward doesnt worth the frustration the half dead pvp brings, and even old player just play AT and go play other contents.

[Jekkt.6045]

> @"felix.2386" said:

> > @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

> >

> > not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

> >

> > the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

>

> back then you had these.

> pvp level was something of prestige, which is why finishers were prestigious for the dedicated

>

> and glory's reward is also tied to pvp level, i remember getting majestic sword or seeing phoenix player wearing runic blade and made me grind more

>

> and winning match had RNG rare pvp skin drops which also made me grind a ton

>

> which will all keep players, new players stick.

>

> now level has nothing related to it, other then finisher which finishes at 80 and easy to get with exp nerf with no point going over 80

>

> you can't really single out fractal like a single content like pvp/wvw, it is part of pve.

> even so wvw didn't get lot content, but it's still more content then pvp.

> as tokens are actually worth using to perfect gears and infusions, and their achievements are actually long term grind

> and i find myself grinding wvw level because i need the reward increase and i need the wvw skills.

> and has gift of battle which forces player from other content to wvw.

> there's nothing that forces other players to pvp and most reward are very short term based and pvp level literally means nothing.

 

yeah you got skins from pvp, but they were just that. pvp skins. they only had worth for people playing pvp as you could only use those and the finishers there (well finishers in wvw too). nobody back then could have known you could carry them over one day. the change to pvp rank was really dumb and i still hate it to this day. the random pvp skins were only up to your own pvp rank as far as i remember.

 

the reason why i single out fractals is because that's pretty much all they got this year. no raids or other relevant stuff. you could include strike missions but eh.. i should clarify that i don't see living story or map events as pve content because it's just mindless farming. you might have a different opinion on that.

 

yeah wvw has infusions and stuff, but as a pvp player i don't really have any use for them so i don't really mind pvp not having them.

 

pvp has the legendary wings. they actually promised us to make them limited and release a new legendary back every 4 seasons... classic anet. we have some ugly armor skins and a sucky legendary armor i guess. oh and the llamas. then the weird toys from mAT which 99% of the playerbase will never get because nobody actually wants to form a team or put any effort in. the pvp "reward" most players are probably after are the ladder titles.

 

 

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Its an old game. Prestige and rewards lose their meaning after 8+ years.

[felix.2386]

> @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > @"felix.2386" said:

> > > @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > > i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

> > >

> > > not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

> > >

> > > the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

> >

> > back then you had these.

> > pvp level was something of prestige, which is why finishers were prestigious for the dedicated

> >

> > and glory's reward is also tied to pvp level, i remember getting majestic sword or seeing phoenix player wearing runic blade and made me grind more

> >

> > and winning match had RNG rare pvp skin drops which also made me grind a ton

> >

> > which will all keep players, new players stick.

> >

> > now level has nothing related to it, other then finisher which finishes at 80 and easy to get with exp nerf with no point going over 80

> >

> > you can't really single out fractal like a single content like pvp/wvw, it is part of pve.

> > even so wvw didn't get lot content, but it's still more content then pvp.

> > as tokens are actually worth using to perfect gears and infusions, and their achievements are actually long term grind

> > and i find myself grinding wvw level because i need the reward increase and i need the wvw skills.

> > and has gift of battle which forces player from other content to wvw.

> > there's nothing that forces other players to pvp and most reward are very short term based and pvp level literally means nothing.

>

> yeah you got skins from pvp, but they were just that. pvp skins. they only had worth for people playing pvp as you could only use those and the finishers there (well finishers in wvw too). nobody back then could have known you could carry them over one day. the change to pvp rank was really dumb and i still hate it to this day. the random pvp skins were only up to your own pvp rank as far as i remember.

>

> the reason why i single out fractals is because that's pretty much all they got this year. no raids or other relevant stuff. you could include strike missions but eh.. i should clarify that i don't see living story or map events as pve content because it's just mindless farming. you might have a different opinion on that.

>

> yeah wvw has infusions and stuff, but as a pvp player i don't really have any use for them so i don't really mind pvp not having them.

>

> pvp has the legendary wings. they actually promised us to make them limited and release a new legendary back every 4 seasons... classic anet. we have some ugly armor skins and a sucky legendary armor i guess. oh and the llamas. then the weird toys from mAT which 99% of the playerbase will never get because nobody actually wants to form a team or put any effort in. the pvp "reward" most players are probably after are the ladder titles.

>

>

 

Yes, those are pvp only skins, having prestige skins for dedicated players to get over time, is better then having none. it makes player see and be like, ohh i want those.

right now there's 0. people who mastered other contents will come and also deck out their look in pvp as a completionist, but not anymore.

 

PvE simply has the most content compared to wvw and pvp combined, there's no point talking about that.

 

wvw has infusions and etc that's used for wvw which takes a lot of time to grind and keep the players, that is the point.

just like wvw level increases chest ticks and gives wvw skills.

i'm not saying pvp should get exact same thing, but pvp lacks stuff like this that keep players playing,

 

legendary wings are nice, but that's it

even transcendence require you to play wvw is the funny part.

and yes, skins being ugly is also bad, tho i don't have hope on them for that..but they can't even make simple achievements.

wvw has 2500 camp capture, 7500 objective capture, and there's 15 of them all with title.

while there's only 1 for pvp that is champion brawler, the rest are so easy get, making pvp titles way less prestigious to wvw ones.

and yea the only thing people can work toward is title which most people can only get to top 100, it's easy to get and hard to surpass at the same time and doesnt keep player.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[felix.2386]

> @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > @"felix.2386" said:

> > > @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > > i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

> > >

> > > not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

> > >

> > > the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

> >

> > back then you had these.

> > pvp level was something of prestige, which is why finishers were prestigious for the dedicated

> >

> > and glory's reward is also tied to pvp level, i remember getting majestic sword or seeing phoenix player wearing runic blade and made me grind more

> >

> > and winning match had RNG rare pvp skin drops which also made me grind a ton

> >

> > which will all keep players, new players stick.

> >

> > now level has nothing related to it, other then finisher which finishes at 80 and easy to get with exp nerf with no point going over 80

> >

> > you can't really single out fractal like a single content like pvp/wvw, it is part of pve.

> > even so wvw didn't get lot content, but it's still more content then pvp.

> > as tokens are actually worth using to perfect gears and infusions, and their achievements are actually long term grind

> > and i find myself grinding wvw level because i need the reward increase and i need the wvw skills.

> > and has gift of battle which forces player from other content to wvw.

> > there's nothing that forces other players to pvp and most reward are very short term based and pvp level literally means nothing.

>

> yeah you got skins from pvp, but they were just that. pvp skins. they only had worth for people playing pvp as you could only use those and the finishers there (well finishers in wvw too). nobody back then could have known you could carry them over one day. the change to pvp rank was really dumb and i still hate it to this day. the random pvp skins were only up to your own pvp rank as far as i remember.

>

> the reason why i single out fractals is because that's pretty much all they got this year. no raids or other relevant stuff. you could include strike missions but eh.. i should clarify that i don't see living story or map events as pve content because it's just mindless farming. you might have a different opinion on that.

>

> yeah wvw has infusions and stuff, but as a pvp player i don't really have any use for them so i don't really mind pvp not having them.

>

> pvp has the legendary wings. they actually promised us to make them limited and release a new legendary back every 4 seasons... classic anet. we have some ugly armor skins and a sucky legendary armor i guess. oh and the llamas. then the weird toys from mAT which 99% of the playerbase will never get because nobody actually wants to form a team or put any effort in. the pvp "reward" most players are probably after are the ladder titles.

>

>

 

like hell, even you gave top 100 50g end season, people would be fighting for that.

not just the same title that people get for 10th time already

[avey.4201]

sleeping is more entertaining than bunker meta, possibly faster.

[DoomNexus.5324]

> @"felix.2386" said:

> pvp need stuff to make new player stick and grind so they can be better and eventually the skill gap will be reduced.

> at this point, wvw has more player and is more fun.

 

Okay since I'm apparently not allowed to comment on anything else in a thread other than the original topic (otherwise my comment gets removed from a friendly Forum Moderator) I'm just add a comment on this.

 

WvW having more players imo is to be expected since it is meant to be large scale. But Anet just removed any group content other than some occasional tournaments. Realistically you can only participate in 1 or max 2 tournaments a day if you have to work. And it's not really worth it to center your entire playtime around those 2 events in my opinion and apparently a lot of people agree since the participation rate is super low.

Back in the days we had entire PvP guilds but now.. not so many if any at all. I joined one about 2 years ago for plat2+ only, but it was somehow pretty pointless so I left again (and I had a issue with the leader.. anyway).

Without a (separate) full team queue there's no incentive to get others involved with you imo.

For WvW you can just bring a bunch of people with you and roam together or maybe even form zergs.

In PvP you are forced to be alone or have up to 1 other person. It's frustrating we have to rely on complete strangers and demotes forming communities in the game mode. And no.. by being forced into a team with randoms my experience shows that this does not promote socializing, quite the opposite, it just promotes toxicity and a "I don't care anymore"-attitude.

 

Also it's A LOT more useful for newer players to go and join a guild and do some full team queues. They can learn a lot more and a lot faster. But probably nobody centers a guild around Unranked.

So I think the "stuff needed to make new players stick" is a community within the game mode and features they can actually benefit from (aka full team queue).

[ugrakarma.9416]

a really good look armor is that really need, not that 3tier look that they throw at us.

first time i grinded on pvp was for ascension, i ended up liking the game mode, and played it for 2 years.

 

theres the neverwinter pvp armors, the model inst good because the game is older, but at time its worth the grind.

 

theres 10+ pvp armors. https://neverwinter.gamepedia.com/Collection/Epic_PVP_Equipment_(Great_Weapon_Fighter)

[dronte.3416]

Might be a bit offtopic but anyone knows why ROM isn't streaming any more? He was drawing up big plans in the last steam but since then, nothing.

[Styros.8931]

> @"Vancho.8750" said:

> druid sucks

ahahah biggest joke i ever hear

[Swagg.9236]

> @"felix.2386" said:

> why pvp so dead? only 1% of the hardcore players stick because they played pvp for so long for literally nothing other then automated tournaments.

The people who continue to advocate for PvP are generally stuck in an ivory tower that was built when anet pity dumped some cash to get an anemic run in ESL. It wasn't an esports scene; it was a marketing ploy, but nobody would ever call it that because it would undermine their "achievements" in the "gw2 competitive scene." GW2 is entirely dictated by patch notes; not player creativity or innovation. GW2 PvP'ers tend to proclaim or defend their achievements so aggressively precisely because the nature of those achievements is so fragile.

 

[memausz.7264]

I'm going to elaborate it here because you people apparently do not want to hear the truth.

 

Low rewards - not enough gold per ranked match.

 

Fighting unfun builds - renegade (busted), burn guards (skill-less build that does way too much dmg), and bunker necros who have perma spectrum shield via shroud, other bunkers (Druid, hammer warrior, barrier ele, crev w/ rapid amulet, etc.).

 

Toxic PvP culture that can't stand when you point out their nonsense and sends you hate unprovoked.

[suialthor.7164]

> @"felix.2386" said:

> pvp need stuff to make new player stick and grind so they can be better and eventually the skill gap will be reduced.

>

 

Many people defend balancing the game around the top players. Then they wonder why new/average players get frustrated and stop playing. If you want new players to stick around then focus on making the game enjoyable for them. This can range from balancing classes per division, putting forth effort against bots, maps in lower divisions that reduce snowballing either by chance or effect, options to prefer or avoid matches with pairs, etc....

 

Bribing players to do pvp often translates to torture yourself until the item is completed and then stop playing.

[Axl.8924]

> @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

>

> not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

>

> the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

 

Content is important because game can become stale with years and years.

 

Speaking from experience p99 everquest on blue got stale and new server came out to revitalized i personally am not interested because its the same classic expansions and new content every once in a while for GW2 such as the story mode new fractals new raids helps keep peeps interested maybe a few new balance patches on old SPVP WVW map and adding new stuff to maps that improve.

[Jekkt.6045]

> @"Axl.8924" said:

> > @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

> >

> > not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

> >

> > the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

>

> Content is important because game can become stale with years and years.

>

> Speaking from experience p99 everquest on blue got stale and new server came out to revitalized i personally am not interested because its the same classic expansions and new content every once in a while for GW2 such as the story mode new fractals new raids helps keep peeps interested maybe a few new balance patches on old SPVP WVW map and adding new stuff to maps that improve.

 

i'm not saying pvp shouldn't get new stuff. but when i say new stuff i don't mean new skins or more gold or whatever. i don't care about that much because it's not meaningful content.

 

everytime they do add new content to pvp they half-ass it. stronghold was half assed, deathmatch is a mess too.

 

they could just add new skills if they wanted to. add some new utility skills twice a year, new elite specs every 1-2 years, whatever.

 

when they announced elite specs they said they could add some every 6 months.

 

all they ever do is talk, and i'm sick of it.

 

[Axl.8924]

> @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > @"Axl.8924" said:

> > > @"Jekkt.6045" said:

> > > i honestly never really cared about monetary rewards in pvp. back when neanderthals still roamed the earth we used to get by on glory and finishers. good old phoenix finisher... people in pvp mocked you if you had more than 2k ap lol.

> > >

> > > not like other game modes are getting much content either. 1 fractal a year or 0 doesn't make a big difference. wvw? do they have updates other than the mount?

> > >

> > > the problem for new players was and is still the very same one. terrible introduction to pvp. the tutorial is so garbage i wouldn't even call it a tutorial. conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes terrible builds.

> >

> > Content is important because game can become stale with years and years.

> >

> > Speaking from experience p99 everquest on blue got stale and new server came out to revitalized i personally am not interested because its the same classic expansions and new content every once in a while for GW2 such as the story mode new fractals new raids helps keep peeps interested maybe a few new balance patches on old SPVP WVW map and adding new stuff to maps that improve.

>

> i'm not saying pvp shouldn't get new stuff. but when i say new stuff i don't mean new skins or more gold or whatever. i don't care about that much because it's not meaningful content.

>

> everytime they do add new content to pvp they half-kitten it. stronghold was half assed, deathmatch is a mess too.

>

> they could just add new skills if they wanted to. add some new utility skills twice a year, new elite specs every 1-2 years, whatever.

>

> when they announced elite specs they said they could add some every 6 months.

>

> all they ever do is talk, and i'm sick of it.

>

 

Me too i think this game is going to die in pvp if they don-t do some meaningful way to improve way to make game more enjoyable to noobs like me while allowing complexity needed that its fun to end. Pve too since having changes to your favorite class/elite spec that changes and makes it so frustrating.

 

You go from one way of playing tempest to having to camp fire to some new frustrating thing.

[The Fear.3865]

They should stop thinking about e-sport or pseudo balance and add some fun. Gw2 is so dynamic we could have every game modes any fps/quake like could have, capture the flag, deathmatch/team deathmatch, theme arenas with ban skill/spec (like codex in gw1). And please, RANDOM ARENAS without matchmaking and something like title/achievements on winstreak. Why all gw2 is about punishing winstreak ?

 

New game modes, new rewards, some titles, achievements, special pvp items.

 

Gw2 is a mmorpg, and pvp has nothing to give.

 

It's actually easy to add some fun on pvp, and reasons for players to come back. They don't even try.

[scorekeeper.6524]

The problems of any PvP is majorly due to the mindset of the player base. Because we are so individualistic and wanting to be the greatest, any obstacle, real or perceived, is seen as unjust. We divorce having fun from tryharding and gaining rank, and instead of self reflecting on our own flaws, we project our ire on outer elements, usually ones beyond our control.

[John.8507]

Doesn't seem to be dead...would be nice with less bots or idle players...They need to encourage the new players to join, but always find a match to join in less that 2.30 normally so I wouldn't say it was dead.

 

There is alot of rewards and achievements separate from winning but could be more as most players would have done them