Skimmer - water speed buff is nice, but what about land?

[Gehenna.3625]

Erm, each mount has different advantages and they all have different speeds on land as it is. Use the mount where it's useful. I agree though that it should be easier to swap mounts. I would like to see the option that when you select another mount while mounted that it instantly switches you to the other mount.

 

[starlinvf.1358]

> @"maddoctor.2738" said:

> What I don't understand is why is the skimmer losing speed on land after you press space? So imagine this situation, you are on water and about to hit land, you hit space and when the skimmer gets over land it is slowed down. This makes it look so weird. I can understand when you move to reduce the speed over land (for balance reasons I guess?) but not while you are pressing space, it just feels awkward. It's even worse when random obstacles in the water that you jump over, like pieces of wood or stone floating, that also reduce your speed.

>

> So my Skimmer suggestion: do not reduce the speed of the skimmer while pressing Space, or if you want it more complex, don't reduce speed if you press space while on water.

 

When POF launched, Skimmer didn't even give a Speed boost over water. That was added later to give the Skimmer some identity, and improve its utility over a domain it has exclusive control over. POF doesn't have much water in it, and the Skimmer existed exclusively to traverse over Quicksand and Sulfur.... neither of which exists outside of POF (and barely exists in LS4 maps). However...... puddles exist all over Tyria, and those are difficult to spot hazards for terrestrial mounts. It made it a natural candidate for the Skimmer to gain obvious utility, while also providing a solution to getting around water heavy maps faster.

 

The only short fall is the method of detection used to activate the speed boost, as the rapid speed changes break flow in coastal areas with a lot of shallow puddles. "Correcting" it involves some changes to the physics engine, and adding a friction ramp up/ramp down function (something the game content doesn't actually use thus far, as far as I can tell), so you get something of a gradual "drag effect" over terrestrial surfaces until its down to its land speed. Roller Beetle Drifting also doesn't use friction the way most physics engines would handle it..... so I'm unsure of the method they're using to create that feature. It, and the Skimmer's normal drifting behavior, feel more like they're directly controlled by a throttle, rather then friction.

[CETheLucid.3964]

> @"Curunen.8729" said:

> A simple 20% or so speed buff on land would be enough that it doesn't feel sluggish.

A small QoL land buff wouldn't hurt. ~5-10%. 20% is overkill.

What we really need though is for Skimmers to be usable underwater.

[Ashen.2907]

> @"Khisanth.2948" said:

> > @"Ashen.2907" said:

> > Isnt the skimmer already faster than unmounted movement on land?

>

> Yes. Even the slowest mount if faster than the unmounted cap of 400.

 

That is what I thought. So the skimmer landspeed is already a buff.

[Justine.6351]

i like skimmer for going over garbage terrain that my raptor would get caught on frequently.

[Curunen.8729]

Thanks for necroing this thread... :/

 

My opinion has changed since the Roller Beetle, along with the mirror masked jackal and kourna jackrabbit, such that I prefer and enjoy going over land with these now instead. Amazing how much difference a new skin/model and audio/visual effects can make with two mounts I really didn't care for before...

 

Therefore I personally don't really care as to the outcome of what I said in the OP. By all means continue to discuss, and of course I wouldn't turn my nose up at a skimmer QoL buff on land - it would still be welcomed (even some thing like delayed deceleration when moving from water land to even out transition across shallows), but I'm not actively advocating for anything now either.

 

Want to make that clear for anyone who takes issue with the OP.

 

[Khisanth.2948]

At least it isn't the slowest on land :P

[Tanner Blackfeather.6509]

> @"starlinvf.1358" said:

> > @"maddoctor.2738" said:

> > What I don't understand is why is the skimmer losing speed on land after you press space? So imagine this situation, you are on water and about to hit land, you hit space and when the skimmer gets over land it is slowed down. This makes it look so weird. I can understand when you move to reduce the speed over land (for balance reasons I guess?) but not while you are pressing space, it just feels awkward. It's even worse when random obstacles in the water that you jump over, like pieces of wood or stone floating, that also reduce your speed.

> >

> > So my Skimmer suggestion: do not reduce the speed of the skimmer while pressing Space, or if you want it more complex, don't reduce speed if you press space while on water.

>

> When POF launched, Skimmer didn't even give a Speed boost over water. That was added later to give the Skimmer some identity, and improve its utility over a domain it has exclusive control over.

Incorrect. It always had a speed boost over water/sulfur/quicksand. This boost was later increased to the current speed.

 

> [...] Quicksand and Sulfur.... neither of which exists outside of POF (and barely exists in LS4 maps). [...]

Tiiiiiiny little correction: Insignificant on the whole, but Dry Top has quicksand. Meant to be traversed via Zephyrite Crystals, but still.

>

> The only short fall is the method of detection used to activate the speed boost, as the rapid speed changes break flow in coastal areas with a lot of shallow puddles. "Correcting" it involves some changes to the physics engine, and adding a friction ramp up/ramp down function (something the game content doesn't actually use thus far, as far as I can tell), so you get something of a gradual "drag effect" over terrestrial surfaces until its down to its land speed. Roller Beetle Drifting also doesn't use friction the way most physics engines would handle it..... so I'm unsure of the method they're using to create that feature. It, and the Skimmer's normal drifting behavior, feel more like they're directly controlled by a throttle, rather then friction.

 

A workaround to this would be to set "hovering" speed to the same as "over water" speed. This would mean you could parry those spots of land among shallow water by predicting when to hover over them.

 

[Eddie Royale.9605]

> @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> And you can leap forward with raptor but griffon is still better for longer distance, you know. The intention of each mount is clear and skimmer's is being to be used on water.

Probably a stupid question, and I'm sorry for asking, but what's the purpose of the raptor when the Griffon is better than it for long distance travel and can also fly across gaps? Is it just for the high damage engage?

[Cragga the Eighty Third.60]

> @"Tanner Blackfeather.6509" said:

> > @"starlinvf.1358" said:

> > > @"maddoctor.2738" said:

> > > What I don't understand is why is the skimmer losing speed on land after you press space? So imagine this situation, you are on water and about to hit land, you hit space and when the skimmer gets over land it is slowed down. This makes it look so weird. I can understand when you move to reduce the speed over land (for balance reasons I guess?) but not while you are pressing space, it just feels awkward. It's even worse when random obstacles in the water that you jump over, like pieces of wood or stone floating, that also reduce your speed.

> > >

> > > So my Skimmer suggestion: do not reduce the speed of the skimmer while pressing Space, or if you want it more complex, don't reduce speed if you press space while on water.

> >

> > When POF launched, Skimmer didn't even give a Speed boost over water. That was added later to give the Skimmer some identity, and improve its utility over a domain it has exclusive control over.

> Incorrect. It always had a speed boost over water/sulfur/quicksand. This boost was later increased to the current speed.

>

> > [...] Quicksand and Sulfur.... neither of which exists outside of POF (and barely exists in LS4 maps). [...]

> Tiiiiiiny little correction: Insignificant on the whole, but Dry Top has quicksand. Meant to be traversed via Zephyrite Crystals, but still.

> >

> > The only short fall is the method of detection used to activate the speed boost, as the rapid speed changes break flow in coastal areas with a lot of shallow puddles. "Correcting" it involves some changes to the physics engine, and adding a friction ramp up/ramp down function (something the game content doesn't actually use thus far, as far as I can tell), so you get something of a gradual "drag effect" over terrestrial surfaces until its down to its land speed. Roller Beetle Drifting also doesn't use friction the way most physics engines would handle it..... so I'm unsure of the method they're using to create that feature. It, and the Skimmer's normal drifting behavior, feel more like they're directly controlled by a throttle, rather then friction.

>

> A workaround to this would be to set "hovering" speed to the same as "over water" speed. This would mean you could parry those spots of land among shallow water by predicting when to hover over them.

>

 

Or maybe a mechanic like, when you are hovering, your mount maintains its current speed whatever the terrain. So if you are speeding over water and jump over a little island, you do not slow down. (And if on land, for whatever reason, if you jump-hover over a puddle, you do not speed up.)

[LucianDK.8615]

> @"Eddie Royale.9605" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > And you can leap forward with raptor but griffon is still better for longer distance, you know. The intention of each mount is clear and skimmer's is being to be used on water.

> Probably a stupid question, and I'm sorry for asking, but what's the purpose of the raptor when the Griffon is better than it for long distance travel and can also fly across gaps? Is it just for the high damage engage?

 

Raptor is much faster than the griffon on ground. But the griffon have it much easier with snap vertical ascent and crossing short to long gaps, which is pretty much why I never use the raptor anymore. Sure the griffon is slower, but its just so much more versatile movement wise.

[Lanhelin.3480]

I suggest to boost the speed at least when travelling over ice, maybe 2/3 or half of the water-boost, because ice is water too, just in another aggregate state.

[Phoebe Ascension.8437]

I wouldnt mind current skimmer speed, if water didnt often get cancelled immediately by land to be water land water land again, that a raptor is actually better then skimmer. No pet ever should be better then skimmer if 50% area is water. This is not the case atm. Imo the water speedboost should ignore land for 3 sec or so, to make small waterpooling much easier. Then the land punishment can stay imo. But other then on huge sea's/lakes, skimmer is just very annoying cause of the land/water mix slow down.

[InsaneQR.7412]

> @"Tanner Blackfeather.6509" said:

> Most of all, I want a smoother slow-down so going over shallows don't feel so choppy!

 

This is probably the most reasonabke suggestion here. It keeps the niche of skimmer.

 

It would be cool if it would be like the beetle. So you can speed up significantly over water and slow down on land. Would make skimmer even more the go to water mount and even useful for long distance over water travel faster than on land.

[Plautze.6290]

> @"Phoebe Ascension.8437" said:

> I wouldnt mind current skimmer speed, if water didnt often get cancelled immediately by land to be water land water land again, that a raptor is actually better then skimmer. No pet ever should be better then skimmer if 50% area is water. This is not the case atm. Imo the water speedboost should ignore land for 3 sec or so, to make small waterpooling much easier. Then the land punishment can stay imo. But other then on huge sea's/lakes, skimmer is just very annoying cause of the land/water mix slow down.

 

I second this! As the skimmer is sort of hovering, it shouldn't slow down the very moment it leaves "swimming water" but instead decelerate.

In that way, the skimmer would feel much smoother (which is what you'd expect from a living hovercraft).

[Eddie Royale.9605]

> @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> Raptor is much faster than the griffon on ground. But the griffon have it much easier with snap vertical ascent and crossing short to long gaps, which is pretty much why I never use the raptor anymore. Sure the griffon is slower, but its just so much more versatile movement wise.

But isn't the beetle faster than the raptor on the ground now?

 

Though I guess Beetle and Griffon are "optional" mounts, so raptor does still have it's place as the long distance travel mount of the core four. And it's basically free...

[Fat Disgrace.4275]

You have the beetle for that. Stop being gready

[misterman.1530]

> @"Curunen.8729" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > @"Curunen.8729" said:

> > > > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > > > Because mounts are tools and you use each tool for different situations. If they unified mounts (you know, like every other mmo) the whole concept of different mount types would be destroyed.

> > >

> > > And a ~20% speed boost for skimmer on land would affect the necessity of other mounts, how?

> >

> > Skimmer is not land mount. It's to be used above water and harsh environments. Purity of purpose

>

> > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > @"Curunen.8729" said:

> > > > @"Strider Pj.2193" said:

> > > > Why not make the raptor jump height equal the bunny mount and sprout wings?

> > > >

> > > > Why not buff bunny so it leaps forward?

> > > >

> > > > I like my griffon but walking with it is slow too..

> > > >

> > > >

> > >

> > > Thank you for being facetious. I'm not asking for raptor speed or being able to fly across every map and teleport anywhere I like...

> > >

> > > A simple 20% or so speed buff on land would be enough that it doesn't feel sluggish.

> > >

> > > As I said in the OP, raptor would still be better for raw speed, springer necessary for height, griffon for flying and jackal for portals. A small land speed buff to skimmer doesn't render all the above useless.

> > >

> > > Finally the turbo boost is something I'm hoping they expand by adding 2-5 skills for every mount with future LW masteries. Not something built in. So every mount would have their own 2, 3, 4 and 5 skill with unique benefits.

> >

> > The point stands. Each mount has its role... enjoy what you can is all.

>

>

> Last I checked skimmer can be used on land.

>

> Or would you both suggest it should it be entirely disabled on land then to preserve the unique role of each mount?

>

> As far as I know both Raptor and Jackal can be used interchangeably for a similar purpose, if not for sand portals. Griffon can be used as half a bunny with its jump - does that render the bunny useless?

>

> I'm asking for a small quality of life benefit, not homogenising mount roles...

 

Yeah...I want my Jackal to be able to move in water...I mean, come on!

 

[LucianDK.8615]

Raptor is better for short distances, and it is better at avoiding damage than the beetle. Though the jackal is the best of it of the 3 of them.

[starlinvf.1358]

> @"Eddie Royale.9605" said:

> > @"LucianDK.8615" said:

> > Raptor is much faster than the griffon on ground. But the griffon have it much easier with snap vertical ascent and crossing short to long gaps, which is pretty much why I never use the raptor anymore. Sure the griffon is slower, but its just so much more versatile movement wise.

> But isn't the beetle faster than the raptor on the ground now?

>

> Though I guess Beetle and Griffon are "optional" mounts, so raptor does still have it's place as the long distance travel mount of the core four. And it's basically free...

 

The Beetle has a LONG ramp up time for speed, and gets hung up on uneven terrain or short turns. From usage, the Raptor has the Best quick travel for 0 to 4000 units due to the instant acceleration of the leap. But its horrible for rocky terrain unless you separate the jump/action binds, as it frequently gets caught on any small, but steep changes in terrain height. Despite that, its really good for gathering runs, since nodes tend to not be too far apart, and you have dismount frequently anyway.

 

But for overall travel, the Jackal is a winner. Higher base speed then Raptor, but when including their movement skills, they're neck and neck in travel speed. But the Jackal can make small jumps without automatically activating its movement skills, and the teleport can actually ride up slopes in some cases (something the Raptor gets slowed by). For long runs you can put it on auto-run and let it go at its base speed. Plus if you're making falls, the teleport can reset fall distance, so you can prevent fall damage. Teleport can also change direction in mid-air, which can be very useful if you're aware of it.

 

Raptor = best for short, quick travel, or getting through dense enemy formations

Jackal = best for uneven terrain that wouldn't demand a Griffon, jumpping off cliffs, or navigating tight areas

Roller Beetle = best for open areas with few obstacles and smooth terrain transition

Griffon = best for short, rapid vertical gain, and using height advantage to clear gaps or obstacles. Making it ideal for hilly areas that don't specifically need a Springer to clear.

[AliamRationem.5172]

I think it would be nice if they made a few improvements to the skimmer. Maybe these:

 

- Ability to mount and travel underwater.

 

- Change speed boost over water to a buff that lasts 3 seconds and refreshes every 1 second while hovering or while over water

 

This would fix a couple of minor annoyances, specifically the times where you try to mount on water but your character is ever so slightly underwater and the start/stop feeling you get when traveling over shallows and your skimmer passes over a tiny piece of land. The speed boost change would allow it to work over land while hovering, hopefully long enough to make it viable over short distances but not enough to overlap the land mounts on their home territory.

 

 

[AliamRationem.5172]

> @"Eddie Royale.9605" said:

> > @"Kheldorn.5123" said:

> > And you can leap forward with raptor but griffon is still better for longer distance, you know. The intention of each mount is clear and skimmer's is being to be used on water.

> Probably a stupid question, and I'm sorry for asking, but what's the purpose of the raptor when the Griffon is better than it for long distance travel and can also fly across gaps? Is it just for the high damage engage?

 

The griffon is only faster over certain terrain. It is more versatile, but significantly slower in many places. The raptor also has one of the best engage attacks. I don't see why you wouldn't use both. They are certainly the two mounts that get used the most when I play.

[hugo.4705]

Agree with orpheal, also a mount that can climb cliffs and rocky walls would be a fabulous adition the same for an underwater mount, why not a kind of jellyfish? The fact is, I love manta rays and skimmer should be able to dive and increase your swimming spead, better idea than swimming speed infusion: a great joke.

[Ceit.7619]

I realize this is a necroed post, but I think the skimmer does not need land speed. What it DOES need, is the ability to mount it in combat, perhaps on some sort of cooldown. Either that, or stop making environmental damage put us in combat so we can mount the skimmer when the *sand* is killing us.

[silor.5034]

I did a post about some of this stuff a little while back, one of the things I hate is how once you hit land any land no mater how large and this includes things like docks or any other object out of the water its like you go through a wall. make the transition smother, the roller beetle can coast so why not add this mechanic to the skimmer, and also add its water speed buff to its hover ability so that crossing things out side the water can be done without slowing down.