MESMER-ELUSIVE MIND NERF- Are you Happy now?

[LazySummer.2568]

trash nerf, stunbreak is still there lol and i like all the irrelevant arugments stating how every pro mirages were using IH long time ago anyways because EM was "trash" already before this patch, even though it's used by every single meta mirage builds. I mean if it was really trash and it got nerfed to more trash such that you guys never took it in the first place, why do you guys even care?

[jportell.2197]

> @"LazySummer.2568" said:

> trash nerf, stunbreak is still there lol and i like all the irrelevant arugments stating how every pro mirages were using IH long time ago anyways because EM was "trash" already before this patch, even though it's used by every single meta mirage builds. I mean if it was really trash and it got nerfed to more trash such that you guys never took it in the first place, why do you guys even care?

 

Mainly because Mesmer as a class seems to always be the source of the PvP community's irrational ire.

[breno.5423]

> now remove the stunbreak

 

.

[Vieux P.1238]

> @"Sylosi.6503" said:

> > @"jportell.2197" said:

> > > @"Sylosi.6503" said:

> > > > @"Kako.1930" said:

> > > > I'm sure the people who were complaining about it are thrilled that they got their own way, but have moved on to complaining about something else. ☺️

> > >

> > > You mean like the OP who a few days ago started a thread complaining about how broken he thinks Holosmith is, which makes this thread an musing demonstration of hypocrisy.

> > >

> > >

> >

> > And static discharge elixir Holo is fine?

> >

> > Riiiiiiiigggghht

>

> Whether it is fine or not is irrelevant to what I wrote.

 

It has all the relevance in the world. Just what you stated about my hypocrisy post about holo, you made it relevant. Like really!

[Swagg.9236]

> @"Raiden The Beast.3016" said:

> Now we will see the IH OP nerf wishes

 

Considering how, if I bother to play the game at all, I've consistently used IH on mesmer builds, it's very easy to consider it pretty busted. Sword IH spam in particular is catastrophically cancerous. Shame too considering the effect is kind of cool and functionally flavorful. It's just that potentially quadrupling the effects of already powerful spam skills which activate under the umbrella of an invulnerability period is an absolutely arenanet-tier intelligent game design decision.

[Highlie.7641]

arenanet-tier intelligent game design decision.

 

I like that.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

its now counter productive to use. just remove the stunbreak and the exhaustion lol.

[sephiroth.4217]

> @"Kako.1930" said:

> I'm sure the people who were complaining about it are thrilled that they got their own way, but have moved on to complaining about something else. ☺️

 

I thought people complained about Mirage evading while stunned, stomping, rezzing and attacking... Not about EM?

 

 

[Curunen.8729]

> @"LazySummer.2568" said:

> trash nerf, stunbreak is still there lol and i like all the irrelevant arugments stating how every pro mirages were using IH long time ago anyways because EM was "trash" already before this patch, even though it's used by every single meta mirage builds. I mean if it was really trash and it got nerfed to more trash such that you guys never took it in the first place, why do you guys even care?

 

Yeah the previous 3s exhaustion was still somewhat useable and the trait was worth it. Now however it's gone past that line of misguided nerf to "we want everyone to play IH (or DC which maybe 2 people here use)" - maybe their motive is forced balance, I don't know. The point is the way they chose to nerf EM twice makes no sense due to the way mirage works, and they'd be better off just deleting the stunbreak altogether - even choosing one solution out of the multiple different points of view from many rational people on this forum and in game suggesting nerfs would have been better than the current solution.

 

An additional example - let's say the EM mirage gets dazed (which are all so common) - if they dodge while dazed they get 6s exhaustion. Why would anyone suffer this when a normal dodge doesn't and it's easier to just wait out the daze.

 

Even with my stubborn opinion on how I wanted EM changed, in this case I hold my hands up and support any of the nerf/changes suggested by any reasonable member on here, instead of what Anet keeps doing.

 

Anyway whatever, IH is more fun and visually satisfying anyway - shame to give up the condi cleanse but oh well. /shrug

[DeceiverX.8361]

> @"Toron.4856" said:

> The problem isnt elusive mind the problem is mirage cloak. The fact that you can dodge while being stunned..

>

> Many mirages were not even using EM at all (pre patch).

 

Yeah but good luck getting ANet and all the people who suck at dodging to admit that it should have never been allowed in the first place.

[Zhaid Zhem.6508]

EM the trait people said "Useless" but took it anyway. Awkward.

Still a BS with an ambush attack that allow a lot of mistakes to be pardoned, and less BS in the skills bar, still a condi cleanse. "trash"

[Kako.1930]

> @"sephiroth.4217" said:

> > @"Kako.1930" said:

> > I'm sure the people who were complaining about it are thrilled that they got their own way, but have moved on to complaining about something else. ☺️

>

> I thought people complained about Mirage evading while stunned, stomping, rezzing and attacking... Not about EM?

>

>

 

Oh, well idk then lol. I just assumed everyone was complaining about EM. xD

 

So I guess nobody is happy then? Mission success! :trollface:

[Arioch.4810]

 

> So I guess nobody is happy then? Mission success! :trollface:

 

It's an age old and tested approach to mediating between multiple sides - make sure nobody is happy ;)

[mortrialus.3062]

I think Elusive Mind is at a point where it would actually be a stronger trait if it was just 1 Condition Cleanse and no stunbreak, especially since meta condi mesmer isn't exactly hurting for stun breaks. 6 seconds of exhaustion is pretty brutal.

[Hylo.1968]

> @"incisorr.9502" said:

> This is a worrying trend, people should be very sad ,lmao

>

> Elusive Mind has been bad since the first nerf cus as a mesmer being exhausted for 3 sec and not having access to ur stamina abilities is horrible. I've personally never used EM and i won quite decisively all my mesmer 1v1s in random games(after i got mirage that is) and over time every single person ive fought swapped to IH and mirror as opposed to EM + Ineptitude and now this nerf pretty much shows that arena net are super detached from pvp and don't really know whats happening cus EM hasnt been good for a long while and EM hasnt been used in high elo at all

>

> ive seen like 2 mesmers still run EM +Ineptitude and while it still works they lose 1v1s quite decisively

>

> im not affected by this but it just shows that we cant expect to get the changes we need cus EM nerf makes no sense.

>

> "Problem "with mesmer is that its designed to confuse you (detarget, invis, illusions, blinks) and the core of gw2's population are fans from gw1 and by this point gw1 is quite old and so are their fans so the average player in gw2 is older than other mmos which also means they are likely worse (not guaranteed but still) on average so they can't deal with a concept like that and just end up whining but they don't even know what the exact problem is . Other than that mesmer hasn't been the best class in spvp for awhile. in Plat 3/legendary there are 2-3 mesmers currently out of 70 people and even if most of the higher rated ppl just sign in duo they don't sign in duo with a mesmer for the most part

> portal is overrated as hell, it's just a 75 sec cd blink with longer range, in terms of mobility you're not actually more mobile than a thief still.. you just have that one thing every now and then

>

> and power mesmer has always been good , i dunno whats with the "CONDI MESMER QQ" when condi mesmer is actually "weaker" . The only advantage condi mesmer has over power is that it can fight in closer range (which usually means on points) and that's why some people end up saying power is worse when in reality power is super easy to play in comparison (in terms of doing damage for x buttons) and does huge burst in team fights while also being tankier at the same time (cus u can get protection in mirage instead axe)

>

> most people just dont understand whats happening it seems, being happy about this change is only good if ur like 1.4k elo i guess? I don't see any elusive mind mesmers doing anything in my games

 

you say?

you can't spam your keys as power gs dude.Unless you spam Spatial Surge.

for a complete burst you need 4-5 keys and this combo (mirror blade-mantra- jaunt-f1-mind stab) still one of the most obvious and telegraphed. Not to mention it requires a LoS.

 

in the other hand we got condi-DE (in sinergy with IH) which makes your condi burst stupid af (staff-scepter-axe choose what ypu want) JUST DODGE

[Zawn.9647]

not sure if this is a troll post or not - elusive mind is just one of the dozen things that are OP in mesmers...

hello 587 condi applications? hello stealthing to run away? hello blink,jaunt,portal? hello 4 other mesmers to get visual confusion on your enemies? hello dodge that doesnt interrupt what you're doing? hello invulnerabilities? i can keep going :)

[jportell.2197]

> @"Zawn.9647" said:

> not sure if this is a troll post or not - elusive mind is just one of the dozen things that are OP in mesmers...

> hello 587 condi applications? hello stealthing to run away? hello blink,jaunt,portal? hello 4 other mesmers to get visual confusion on your enemies? hello dodge that doesnt interrupt what you're doing? hello invulnerabilities? i can keep going :)

 

And your main is engi?

 

??????

[Arcaedus.7290]

Don't like exhaust here, just like I didn't like it on daredevil's dash. There aren't any other traits i can think of in the game that have the potential to be double-edged swords like this and with 6s exhaust, this trait has arguably become more of a liability than a benefit. That's not good trait design imo.

 

Good mirage players in pvp or in duels are going to use IH (and have been using it for a long time now) since they don't rely on that stunbreak. They know they can already evade while CCed with mirage cloak. This nerf was misguided. IMO they should remove the exhaustion and stunbreak since the main reason many mirages used this trait was the condi clear. May have to add something else to the trait though since just cleansing 1 condi on dodge for a GM trait isn't so great.

[snowflake.9037]

In ever believed EM was the sole culprit. Yes it contributed, but the problem has always been being able to dodge while stunned (gain evade frames), not so much that you stun break at least IMO.

 

Now you'll be knocked down or stunned, but still avoid the burst with IH. That *** needs to go away.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

The issue is dodging while stunned to avoid burst. I'm sure OP knows that and is trying to imply that because Mesmer got a huge nerf, the problem has been resolved and complaints about its mechanics are unfounded, even though the issue remains.

 

However, with EM being so unsavory to take now, there is counterplay.

 

If they run EM, they will run out of gas for evades under pressure after a successful stun.

 

If they run IH, they will be harder to kill but you can bait dodges if a stun connects. and deliver burst after.

 

It's annoying, but if you bring cleanses you can probably manage. Day one mesmers are suffering build whiplash after being carried by EM.

 

[kipthelip.5802]

> @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > @"viquing.8254" said:

> > > > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > > No, that part is fine. I think they need the condi cleanse. Stunbreak on dodge is stupid

> > > Plethora of aoe CC (with some with a duration >= 2 sec.) is stupid.

> > >

> >

> > Then we should nerf that too. The big aoe CC offender right now is holosmith IMO. Mesmer has tons of ways to fight CC though..

>

> Yes, like we all know that your main DH is well balance & has no need to be nerfed in any way.

 

You just outed yourself as someone not to be taken seriously. DH is weak. EM needed to be nerfed and no Im still not totally happy now as mrauls pointed out the stun break should go.

[otto.5684]

I do not think this was a good change. I preferred Anet just removed this trait all together in favor of something else that is effective in PvP. Instead, this change just kills it..

 

Anyway, I guess everyone will run Infinite Horizon in every game mode now. So much for diversity...

[mes.4607]

> @"kipthelip.5802" said:

> > @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > > @"viquing.8254" said:

> > > > > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > > > No, that part is fine. I think they need the condi cleanse. Stunbreak on dodge is stupid

> > > > Plethora of aoe CC (with some with a duration >= 2 sec.) is stupid.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Then we should nerf that too. The big aoe CC offender right now is holosmith IMO. Mesmer has tons of ways to fight CC though..

> >

> > Yes, like we all know that your main DH is well balance & has no need to be nerfed in any way.

>

> You just outed yourself as someone not to be taken seriously. DH is weak. EM needed to be nerfed and no Im still not totally happy now as mrauls pointed out the stun break should go.

 

I was taken aback too... Never seen anyone say that before LOL

[Zawn.9647]

> @"jportell.2197" said:

> > @"Zawn.9647" said:

> > not sure if this is a troll post or not - elusive mind is just one of the dozen things that are OP in mesmers...

> > hello 587 condi applications? hello stealthing to run away? hello blink,jaunt,portal? hello 4 other mesmers to get visual confusion on your enemies? hello dodge that doesnt interrupt what you're doing? hello invulnerabilities? i can keep going :)

>

> And your main is engi?

>

> ??????

 

are you seriously going to compare Engi to Mesmer? ROFL

i play Scrapper on WvW, yes

[Vieux P.1238]

> @"kipthelip.5802" said:

> > @"Vieux P.1238" said:

> > > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > > @"viquing.8254" said:

> > > > > @"mrauls.6519" said:

> > > > > No, that part is fine. I think they need the condi cleanse. Stunbreak on dodge is stupid

> > > > Plethora of aoe CC (with some with a duration >= 2 sec.) is stupid.

> > > >

> > >

> > > Then we should nerf that too. The big aoe CC offender right now is holosmith IMO. Mesmer has tons of ways to fight CC though..

> >

> > Yes, like we all know that your main DH is well balance & has no need to be nerfed in any way.

>

> You just outed yourself as someone not to be taken seriously. DH is weak. EM needed to be nerfed and no Im still not totally happy now as mrauls pointed out the stun break should go.

 

& yet no one but you both, cares. Hey! since your moving the goal post every time they nerf it, why stop at the stun break? It's obvious your not happy. I mean they just smashed 6 seconds of exhaustion & still, you getting pummeled like a first timer. mehhh that's nothing. (sarcasm)