Shadowmoon.7986 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > It helps to actually understand the context. The people who were let go, reportedly, were all working on non-GW2 related projects that had stalled or were being shutdown. Some devs reportedly were re-tasked BACK to GW2. > > So no, the layoffs mean nothing with regards to GW2, but speaks to ANET as a company, and what they were doing. Again, reportedly, the only title ANET is now currently working on is GW2. > > So you tell me: is that good or bad? Actually this is not true. Have you even looked at the list of who was laid off https://amp.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/autnqg/list_of_laid_off_devs_lets_keep_this_updated/ Notable to me is Gaile Grey and many members of the raid/fractal team. And this was when wing 7 had not even shipped. They had to rehire cameron rich for what I speculate to fix wing 7 (and yes i know he is on the living world team now). Many people who were laid off were working on gw2. So this is bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkeyspit.3965 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said: > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > > > It helps to actually understand the context. The people who were let go, reportedly, were all working on non-GW2 related projects that had stalled or were being shutdown. Some devs reportedly were re-tasked BACK to GW2. > > > > So no, the layoffs mean nothing with regards to GW2, but speaks to ANET as a company, and what they were doing. Again, reportedly, the only title ANET is now currently working on is GW2. > > > > So you tell me: is that good or bad? > > Actually this is not true. Have you even looked at the list of who was laid off > https://amp.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/autnqg/list_of_laid_off_devs_lets_keep_this_updated/ > Notable to me is Gaile Grey and many members of the raid/fractal team. And this was when wing 7 had not even shipped. They had to rehire cameron rich for what I speculate to fix wing 7 (and yes i know he is on the living world team now). Many people who were laid off were working on gw2. > So this is bad. > And did you know that Gaile wasn't laid off, but voluntarily took an exit package, likely to avoid someone else being laid off? I mean, neither you nor I know everything that is going on here, but several reports have corroborated the point that ANET was cancelling non-GW2 related projects and laying off those working on them, and re-tasking some back to working on GW2. This all suggests a refocusing on GW2 by ANET which is a good thing. Or you can instead choose to tremble in fear that this game is about to shut down. I can promise that your mental anguish is of no concern to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firebeard.1746 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 Wow classic will die out real fast. I give it like a month before everyone realizes how timeconsuming it is and that they're not in college any more. Afterwards it will have a niche following among streamers and people who are unemployed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowmoon.7986 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said: > > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > > > > > It helps to actually understand the context. The people who were let go, reportedly, were all working on non-GW2 related projects that had stalled or were being shutdown. Some devs reportedly were re-tasked BACK to GW2. > > > > > > So no, the layoffs mean nothing with regards to GW2, but speaks to ANET as a company, and what they were doing. Again, reportedly, the only title ANET is now currently working on is GW2. > > > > > > So you tell me: is that good or bad? > > > > Actually this is not true. Have you even looked at the list of who was laid off > > https://amp.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/autnqg/list_of_laid_off_devs_lets_keep_this_updated/ > > Notable to me is Gaile Grey and many members of the raid/fractal team. And this was when wing 7 had not even shipped. They had to rehire cameron rich for what I speculate to fix wing 7 (and yes i know he is on the living world team now). Many people who were laid off were working on gw2. > > So this is bad. > > > > And did you know that Gaile wasn't laid off, but voluntarily took an exit package, likely to avoid someone else being laid off? I mean, neither you nor I know everything that is going on here, but several reports have corroborated the point that ANET was cancelling non-GW2 related projects and laying off those working on them, and re-tasking some back to working on GW2. This all suggests a refocusing on GW2 by ANET which is a good thing. > > Or you can instead choose to tremble in fear that this game is about to shut down. I can promise that your mental anguish is of no concern to me. Your claim:"The people who were let go, reportedly, were all working on non-GW2 related projects that had stalled or were being shutdown" Evidence: the list I provided showed people who were actively working on gw2 Retort: that many volenteered so other could keep their job. Unsure how that supports your starting claim? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vayne.8563 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 > @"RoterFuchs.9216" said: > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > @"RoterFuchs.9216" said: > > > > @"Amaranthe.3578" said: > > > > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > > > > @"Amaranthe.3578" said: > > > > > > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > > > > > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > > > > > > > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > > > > > > > > @"Amaranthe.3578" said: > > > > > > > > > > > @"Vlad Morbius.1759" said: > > > > > > > > > > > WoW classic is a fad that will likely only last for those who are stuck in the past. It is a completely different style of gaming which was one of the main reason GW2 was successful and why many people sought out GW2 in the first place so why would we leave to go to something we had little interest in to begin with? Some will try it out and remember just how much of a horrible grinding experience it was and come tearing back here. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When was GW2 successful? Especially compared to something colossal like WoW. > > > > > > > > > > GW2 launched as the "next gen mmo experience" and it just fell flat on its kitten since it doesn't have any sort of vertical progression which is one the core concepts of almost any rpg. GW2 is a very weird beast that appeals to a very specific niche market. > > > > > > > > > > Anyways, GW2 and Classic WoW dont compete over the same players for the most part. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Holy smokes? When was Guild Wars 2 successful? All along. Since day 1. Since it sold 4 million pre launch copies, it's considered successful. You don't compare every new drink that comes out to coke. You don't see a new drink that doesn't make the money coke does isn't successful. That's not how it works. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > WoW launched at a time when there were very very little competition. The market was tiny. They were competing with very niche games and due to the success of other games, largely the Warcraft and Starcraft franchises, they had a ton of money to advertise. Guild Wars 1 would have been competition back then, but didn't have the war chest to advertise and wasn't at true MMO because it' didn't have an open world. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At any rate, now the market is more fragmented. Even WOW has lost a huge section of it's player base, but no one is taking down WoW is the #1 MMO, in my mind ever. If it happens, it will be monumental. Then you have a game like Final Fantasy which is available on both console and computer, and it's the XIVth game in the series. It's also very popular in Asia where a lot of it's playerbase comes from. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guild Wars 2 has been for years in the top five, or six MMORPGs and certainly one of the top MMORPGs in the west. Games like Lineage, which does great in Korea in fact, had to close in the West where it failed. Guild Wars 2 was 6 years old when it had it's first layoffs. TSW and SWTOR had lay offs much sooner. ESO started as a sub game and had to go free to play. FF XIV had to apologize at the start of the game and completely reboot the game, because it was such a disaster. At one point they stopped charging subs, because it was not playable. Due to the fact that they are a popular frachise they got a second chance. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyone who says this game isn't successful because WoW is successful is deluding themselves. Something can be both niche and successful. 7 UP has been around for years and it's a successful drink, but it doesn't sell nearly as much as coke. It still has it's niche and it's still considered successful. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Successful in business only means one thing..meets or exceeds expectations. Guild Wars 2 is largely met or exceeded the expectations of it's investors. How is it not successful? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > They fired Anet employees, who were working on mostly other projects that didn't get off the ground, if you've been paying any attention at all. Companies are not products. Were you the one who mentioned WoW, because Blizzard just laid off a bunch of people too, so I guess you could say that it's going rather bad, but you're not. Compared to something like SWToR which laid off a bunch of a people a year into the game, not 6.5 years. The issue with drawing conclusions in the absence of fact is that you end up drawing the wrong conclusions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anet attempted to diversify by going into other projects and couldn't get those projects finished in either a timely manner, or within budget, or to some level of quality satisfaction. Some of those projects have been cancelled, Some of the devs that worked on those projects moved back to Guild Wars 2. That doesn't say Guild Wars 2 is doing badly, though it doesn't speak very highly necessarily of Anet. Again, Blizzard just laid off a bunch of people, so why aren't you applying the same logic to WoW? > > > > > > > > > > > > A massive failure like this speaks volumes about ANet's competence though. > > > > > > > > > > Or the changing market. Guild Wars 2 remains successful. You know how we know? Stock calls. The company lets people know when games do or don't meet expectations. We've not often (I can only remember one quarter) where it was said Guild Wars 2 didn't meet expectations. And you know, lots of companies go and produce stuff that never gets off the ground. It happens all the time. Look at Everquest Next. Blizzard with Titan. Titan was completely cancelled, but we're not going to use that against blizzard, are we? I'd call that a double standard. Saying that failed projects, or ones that don't materialize indicates anything without knowing a whole lot more than we do is just baseless speculation. > > > > > > > > > > We opened a store that failed, because the guy who was supposed to run it backed out the night before opening and we didn't really have anyone to replace him. Sometimes circumstance can cause something to fail that has nothing to do with competence. Markets change. Situations evolve. It's entirely possible that NcSoft saw their games profits going down pretty much across the board and they felt they had to take action to restore investor confidence and this is what they felt they could afford to cut. This sort of thing happens in business pretty much all the time. > > > > > > > > > > To be fair, it might well indicate incompetence...however we don't have the data to make that call. > > > > > > > > Not use that against Blizz? What? How? Why? > > > > Blizzard is a kitten garbage company now and have been pretty much since they got in bed with Activision. Major failures of any kind show something, always. > > > > > > Titan became Overwatch, which is successful enough. > > > > Titan did not become overwatch. Titan was abandoned. They used the assets they created to make a new game, because why waste the work. It's a; different product. One game that was in production for a couple of years was completely abandoned. A second game was made, a new game that's successful. All they did was use the graphics because they'd already created them. Not the same thing at all. > > Are you really starting to argue about the wording "become" right now? If Titan hadn't happened the way it did there would not have been Overwatch, it's as simple as that. > > Feel free to read up on the history: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titan_(Blizzard_Entertainment_project)#Transition_to_Overwatch I'm saying they started working on the game and produced a completely different game in a completely different genre with assets from that game. That's what I'm saying. If you can't see the difference between that and the game just becoming something, I'm not sure what to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sniperman.1738 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 I wouldn't worry about WoW classic because reality is as long as Ion is head of blizzard, then he will accomplish ruining classic as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VDAC.2137 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 > @"sniperman.1738" said: > I wouldn't worry about WoW classic because reality is as long as Ion is head of blizzard, then he will accomplish ruining classic as well. What’s to ruin? Just read through @"Ghetx.1752"’s description and, wow, I am amazed it was popular back then even! :o I guess because it was the first / only of its kind? It just does not sound fun, and I never liked the aesthetics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taobella.6597 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 probably be a large player base drop for first month or so then people remember what it like to play WoW an go back to whatever they like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swagg.9236 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 > @"Haleydawn.3764" said: > I didn’t realise players had to only play and spend money one game. spending money on gw2 lmao Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vayne.8563 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said: > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said: > > > > @"Turkeyspit.3965" said: > > > > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > > > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > > > > > > > It helps to actually understand the context. The people who were let go, reportedly, were all working on non-GW2 related projects that had stalled or were being shutdown. Some devs reportedly were re-tasked BACK to GW2. > > > > > > > > So no, the layoffs mean nothing with regards to GW2, but speaks to ANET as a company, and what they were doing. Again, reportedly, the only title ANET is now currently working on is GW2. > > > > > > > > So you tell me: is that good or bad? > > > > > > Actually this is not true. Have you even looked at the list of who was laid off > > > https://amp.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/autnqg/list_of_laid_off_devs_lets_keep_this_updated/ > > > Notable to me is Gaile Grey and many members of the raid/fractal team. And this was when wing 7 had not even shipped. They had to rehire cameron rich for what I speculate to fix wing 7 (and yes i know he is on the living world team now). Many people who were laid off were working on gw2. > > > So this is bad. > > > > > > > And did you know that Gaile wasn't laid off, but voluntarily took an exit package, likely to avoid someone else being laid off? I mean, neither you nor I know everything that is going on here, but several reports have corroborated the point that ANET was cancelling non-GW2 related projects and laying off those working on them, and re-tasking some back to working on GW2. This all suggests a refocusing on GW2 by ANET which is a good thing. > > > > Or you can instead choose to tremble in fear that this game is about to shut down. I can promise that your mental anguish is of no concern to me. > > Your claim:"The people who were let go, reportedly, were all working on non-GW2 related projects that had stalled or were being shutdown" > Evidence: the list I provided showed people who were actively working on gw2 > Retort: that many volenteered so other could keep their job. Unsure how that supports your starting claim? But Gaile Gray wasn't actively working on Guild Wars 2, she was a community manager, not a developer, so it's hardly conclusive. And she took a package so other people could work. In fact, you have no idea of what the people who were laid off were actively doing at the time they were laid off, because you're not working at Anet. As for the raid team, it was a small team anyway, and probably raids aren't so important to the bulk of the game's population. I'm pretty sure only a small percentage of the game's population raids. So yeah, raiders might be worried. However we don't have any idea of whether there are fewer devs or more devs, since devs working on other projects were moved to work on Guild Wars 2. You're simply speculating in a vacuum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrizzFreston.5290 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 > @"Mortifera.6138" said: > This game is “not like WoW”? Are you guys serious?! That may have been true in 2012, but everything they’ve done since HoT has been to make this game more like WoW: adding raids, pleasing hardcore fans, adding mounts, adding gear grind (legendary armor, trinkets..), the Skyscale grind, etc. Clearly, because every MMO is like WoW. Whats the point to point out the few things that every MMO has. Where it matters is where its different. Why people play GW2 instead of WoW or vice versa. You basically said GW2 is like WoW because they are both MMOs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 > @"VDAC.2137" said: > > @"sniperman.1738" said: > > I wouldn't worry about WoW classic because reality is as long as Ion is head of blizzard, then he will accomplish ruining classic as well. > > What’s to ruin? Just read through @"Ghetx.1752"’s description and, wow, I am amazed it was popular back then even! :o I guess because it was the first / only of its kind? It just does not sound fun, and I never liked the aesthetics. It was... a pain. And one of the reasons why i got interested in GW1 in the first place. Nowadays i feel even less desire to go back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkeyspit.3965 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 > @"Shadowmoon.7986" said: > Again i am tired of people parroting misinformation which even anet didnt even say. https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2019-02-21-arenanet-reportedly-bracing-for-mass-layoffs https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/69872/update-from-the-guild-wars-2-team/p1 Believe what you want. Ignorance is a choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadowmoon.7986 Posted July 19, 2019 Share Posted July 19, 2019 Learning2read the articles instead of blindly posting links. From your first article "The email went on to say that the company would be cutting costs and restructuring the entirety of ArenaNet" The word entirely means gw2 staff were included, which was confirmed by the reddit layoff list. Also there statement was very clear what not getting effected. "the Guild Wars and Guild Wars 2 game services will not be affected, nor is any upcoming game content canceled" Meaning the game servers were not being shut down, and all announced content was not cancelled, which was the warclaw, episode 6, raid wing 7 and ls5. But it does not mention the staff who were developing it. There were people working on these thing the lost their jobs in the restructuring. There were people outside of these things working on gw2 lost their jobs (for example the website team). To blindly say the only only people who lost their jobs were working on other projects or were not important to the gw2 is disengenious at best and dishonest at worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodgerrule.8739 Posted July 20, 2019 Share Posted July 20, 2019 Guild wars 2 isn’t about standardized progression like other mmos so they don’t have to worry and wow has a monthly fee people will always flock back to guild wars and guild wars 2 because of this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinifair.1026 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Sure, I'll be playing WoW Classic again, most likely. A lot of people think it's purely nostalgia (and for some it might be), but many of the old design philosophies are more appealing to a lot of people, myself included. That said, I'm not worried about GW2. It provides a unique MMO experience and scratches a certain itch that other MMO's do not. Rather, I'm excited to see where they'll take the game next. I hope to see more rewards for actual content in the game and not as Black Lion Skins or gem store items - I think they still have to reach a balance there, since a lot of the better looking stuff is payed for rather than played for. I also still have a lot of stuff I want to go for, so I hope to still be playing GW2 for many years to come. I hope they keep improving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erasculio.2914 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 > @"Vayne.8563" said: > However we don't have any idea of whether there are fewer devs or more devs, since devs working on other projects were moved to work on Guild Wars 2. You're simply speculating in a vacuum. [Actually...](https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2019-04-16-speaking-with-guild-wars-2-developer-arenanet-for-the-first-time-since-the-lay-offs) EDIT: since the forum links are still broken (...), here's the link: https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2019-04-16-speaking-with-guild-wars-2-developer-arenanet-for-the-first-time-since-the-lay-offs > @"Eurogamer" said: > So people _have_ gone from the Guild Wars 2 team? > "It has impacted but-" > Linsey Murdock cut in: "We also got a lot of people back. So in terms of quantity of people on the Guild Wars 2 team: not very affected. But some people who had moved onto other projects came back." So it seems that: * Shadowmoon is right, people from the Guild Wars 2 team did leave * They did got people back who had been assigned on other projects * Despite people getting back, the quantity of people on the GW2 team didn't change much ("not very affected"). Which means, the amount of people they lost was similar to the amount of people they got back. So either they didn't get that many people back, or A LOT of people from the GW2 team left Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > @"Amaranthe.3578" said: > > > > @"Vlad Morbius.1759" said: > > > > WoW classic is a fad that will likely only last for those who are stuck in the past. It is a completely different style of gaming which was one of the main reason GW2 was successful and why many people sought out GW2 in the first place so why would we leave to go to something we had little interest in to begin with? Some will try it out and remember just how much of a horrible grinding experience it was and come tearing back here. > > > > > > When was GW2 successful? Especially compared to something colossal like WoW. > > > GW2 launched as the "next gen mmo experience" and it just fell flat on its kitten since it doesn't have any sort of vertical progression which is one the core concepts of almost any rpg. GW2 is a very weird beast that appeals to a very specific niche market. > > > Anyways, GW2 and Classic WoW dont compete over the same players for the most part. > > > > Holy smokes? When was Guild Wars 2 successful? All along. Since day 1. Since it sold 4 million pre launch copies, it's considered successful. You don't compare every new drink that comes out to coke. You don't see a new drink that doesn't make the money coke does isn't successful. That's not how it works. > > > > WoW launched at a time when there were very very little competition. The market was tiny. They were competing with very niche games and due to the success of other games, largely the Warcraft and Starcraft franchises, they had a ton of money to advertise. Guild Wars 1 would have been competition back then, but didn't have the war chest to advertise and wasn't at true MMO because it' didn't have an open world. > > > > At any rate, now the market is more fragmented. Even WOW has lost a huge section of it's player base, but no one is taking down WoW is the #1 MMO, in my mind ever. If it happens, it will be monumental. Then you have a game like Final Fantasy which is available on both console and computer, and it's the XIVth game in the series. It's also very popular in Asia where a lot of it's playerbase comes from. > > > > Guild Wars 2 has been for years in the top five, or six MMORPGs and certainly one of the top MMORPGs in the west. Games like Lineage, which does great in Korea in fact, had to close in the West where it failed. Guild Wars 2 was 6 years old when it had it's first layoffs. TSW and SWTOR had lay offs much sooner. ESO started as a sub game and had to go free to play. FF XIV had to apologize at the start of the game and completely reboot the game, because it was such a disaster. At one point they stopped charging subs, because it was not playable. Due to the fact that they are a popular frachise they got a second chance. > > > > Anyone who says this game isn't successful because WoW is successful is deluding themselves. Something can be both niche and successful. 7 UP has been around for years and it's a successful drink, but it doesn't sell nearly as much as coke. It still has it's niche and it's still considered successful. > > > > Successful in business only means one thing..meets or exceeds expectations. Guild Wars 2 is largely met or exceeded the expectations of it's investors. How is it not successful? > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. No, that doesn't mean it's not successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaeys.3102 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 Part of the strength of GW2 is that - due to the lack of a sub and the need for constant treadmilling for gear/stats/etc, it is one of the VERY FEW MMOs that doesn't require logging in constantly. It is here when people want to take a short break from another game. It is here when they tire of that other game (and people will tire of WOW classic VERY fast - nostalgia only gets you so far). It is here as a low cost way to still play with friends because you want to play with friends (and not because you feel obligated to log in). That is the true strength of GW2 in the MMO space - and the reason something like WOW Classic has no chance of even denting the profitability and longevity of this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trise.2865 Posted July 21, 2019 Share Posted July 21, 2019 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > Guild Wars 2 has been for years in the top five, or six MMORPGs and certainly one of the top MMORPGs in the west. Games like Lineage, which does great in Korea in fact, had to close in the West where it failed. Guild Wars 2 was 6 years old when it had it's first layoffs. TSW and SWTOR had lay offs much sooner. ESO started as a sub game and had to go free to play. FF XIV had to apologize at the start of the game and completely reboot the game, because it was such a disaster. At one point they stopped charging subs, because it was not playable. Due to the fact that they are a popular frachise they got a second chance. > > > > > > Anyone who says this game isn't successful because WoW is successful is deluding themselves. Something can be both niche and successful. 7 UP has been around for years and it's a successful drink, but it doesn't sell nearly as much as coke. It still has it's niche and it's still considered successful. > > > > > > Successful in business only means one thing..meets or exceeds expectations. Guild Wars 2 is largely met or exceeded the expectations of it's investors. How is it not successful? > > > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > No, that doesn't mean it's not successful. On this subject, it's important to remember that mass layoffs of developers and staff is a far-too-common practice of AAA developers, regardless of the success of the project(s). Studios often mass hire recent grads, work them all-but-literally to death, then fire them and repeat the process; it's called "turn and burn". Just ask Activision, EA, Gearbox, Microsoft, CD Projekt Red, SquareEnix, and countless others about their "record profits" followed immediately by "mass layoffs". It has literally nothing to do with the products' success or failure. ArenaNet has been far and away one of the better places to work for artists and developers (specific cases notwithstanding), with strong job security and little-to-no devastating "crunch time", according to public and employee statements. This was the first mass layoff at ANet since its inception (that we know about), and it was ordered by NCSoft execs cutting costs across the board. ...but that's getting off-topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amaranthe.3578 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > > @"Amaranthe.3578" said: > > > > > @"Vlad Morbius.1759" said: > > > > > WoW classic is a fad that will likely only last for those who are stuck in the past. It is a completely different style of gaming which was one of the main reason GW2 was successful and why many people sought out GW2 in the first place so why would we leave to go to something we had little interest in to begin with? Some will try it out and remember just how much of a horrible grinding experience it was and come tearing back here. > > > > > > > > When was GW2 successful? Especially compared to something colossal like WoW. > > > > GW2 launched as the "next gen mmo experience" and it just fell flat on its kitten since it doesn't have any sort of vertical progression which is one the core concepts of almost any rpg. GW2 is a very weird beast that appeals to a very specific niche market. > > > > Anyways, GW2 and Classic WoW dont compete over the same players for the most part. > > > > > > Holy smokes? When was Guild Wars 2 successful? All along. Since day 1. Since it sold 4 million pre launch copies, it's considered successful. You don't compare every new drink that comes out to coke. You don't see a new drink that doesn't make the money coke does isn't successful. That's not how it works. > > > > > > WoW launched at a time when there were very very little competition. The market was tiny. They were competing with very niche games and due to the success of other games, largely the Warcraft and Starcraft franchises, they had a ton of money to advertise. Guild Wars 1 would have been competition back then, but didn't have the war chest to advertise and wasn't at true MMO because it' didn't have an open world. > > > > > > At any rate, now the market is more fragmented. Even WOW has lost a huge section of it's player base, but no one is taking down WoW is the #1 MMO, in my mind ever. If it happens, it will be monumental. Then you have a game like Final Fantasy which is available on both console and computer, and it's the XIVth game in the series. It's also very popular in Asia where a lot of it's playerbase comes from. > > > > > > Guild Wars 2 has been for years in the top five, or six MMORPGs and certainly one of the top MMORPGs in the west. Games like Lineage, which does great in Korea in fact, had to close in the West where it failed. Guild Wars 2 was 6 years old when it had it's first layoffs. TSW and SWTOR had lay offs much sooner. ESO started as a sub game and had to go free to play. FF XIV had to apologize at the start of the game and completely reboot the game, because it was such a disaster. At one point they stopped charging subs, because it was not playable. Due to the fact that they are a popular frachise they got a second chance. > > > > > > Anyone who says this game isn't successful because WoW is successful is deluding themselves. Something can be both niche and successful. 7 UP has been around for years and it's a successful drink, but it doesn't sell nearly as much as coke. It still has it's niche and it's still considered successful. > > > > > > Successful in business only means one thing..meets or exceeds expectations. Guild Wars 2 is largely met or exceeded the expectations of it's investors. How is it not successful? > > > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > No, that doesn't mean it's not successful. Yeah, it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 > @"Amaranthe.3578" said: > > @"Obtena.7952" said: > > > @"ZeroTheCat.2684" said: > > > > @"Vayne.8563" said: > > > > > @"Amaranthe.3578" said: > > > > > > @"Vlad Morbius.1759" said: > > > > > > WoW classic is a fad that will likely only last for those who are stuck in the past. It is a completely different style of gaming which was one of the main reason GW2 was successful and why many people sought out GW2 in the first place so why would we leave to go to something we had little interest in to begin with? Some will try it out and remember just how much of a horrible grinding experience it was and come tearing back here. > > > > > > > > > > When was GW2 successful? Especially compared to something colossal like WoW. > > > > > GW2 launched as the "next gen mmo experience" and it just fell flat on its kitten since it doesn't have any sort of vertical progression which is one the core concepts of almost any rpg. GW2 is a very weird beast that appeals to a very specific niche market. > > > > > Anyways, GW2 and Classic WoW dont compete over the same players for the most part. > > > > > > > > Holy smokes? When was Guild Wars 2 successful? All along. Since day 1. Since it sold 4 million pre launch copies, it's considered successful. You don't compare every new drink that comes out to coke. You don't see a new drink that doesn't make the money coke does isn't successful. That's not how it works. > > > > > > > > WoW launched at a time when there were very very little competition. The market was tiny. They were competing with very niche games and due to the success of other games, largely the Warcraft and Starcraft franchises, they had a ton of money to advertise. Guild Wars 1 would have been competition back then, but didn't have the war chest to advertise and wasn't at true MMO because it' didn't have an open world. > > > > > > > > At any rate, now the market is more fragmented. Even WOW has lost a huge section of it's player base, but no one is taking down WoW is the #1 MMO, in my mind ever. If it happens, it will be monumental. Then you have a game like Final Fantasy which is available on both console and computer, and it's the XIVth game in the series. It's also very popular in Asia where a lot of it's playerbase comes from. > > > > > > > > Guild Wars 2 has been for years in the top five, or six MMORPGs and certainly one of the top MMORPGs in the west. Games like Lineage, which does great in Korea in fact, had to close in the West where it failed. Guild Wars 2 was 6 years old when it had it's first layoffs. TSW and SWTOR had lay offs much sooner. ESO started as a sub game and had to go free to play. FF XIV had to apologize at the start of the game and completely reboot the game, because it was such a disaster. At one point they stopped charging subs, because it was not playable. Due to the fact that they are a popular frachise they got a second chance. > > > > > > > > Anyone who says this game isn't successful because WoW is successful is deluding themselves. Something can be both niche and successful. 7 UP has been around for years and it's a successful drink, but it doesn't sell nearly as much as coke. It still has it's niche and it's still considered successful. > > > > > > > > Successful in business only means one thing..meets or exceeds expectations. Guild Wars 2 is largely met or exceeded the expectations of it's investors. How is it not successful? > > > > > > Because they fired a bunch of people..? That usually means they did NOT meet the expectations. Actually that usually means it is going rather bad. > > > > No, that doesn't mean it's not successful. > > Yeah, it does. No, it doesn't ... Successful companies do lay people off and can still be successful after that. Not even sure why any reasonable person would deny such a thing. It happens ALL the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnakinJeakin.1604 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 WoW classic will be fun only to the most hardcore WoW players, When the "I want everything given to me" crowd figures out that that they will not get mounts until level 40 and have to walk/run until then; will not get armor and weapons practically given to them but actually have to earn them; have to actually play... they will scoot back to wow easy mode that is currently in crap mode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROMANG.1903 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 WoW classic will have a decent population at start and will gradually fade away. Even Blizzard acknowledged this by stating that they would keep the servers running no matter how small the population becomes. GW2 is more at risk everytime WoW gets an update than it will be when classic comes out, trust me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mortifera.6138 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 No point speculating other than to get replies. We just have to wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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