Psycoprophet.8107

Fine as is

Lol I’m for the pistol mh buff

First thing u want to learn is ignore all the BS non thief players post in the forums as I’m sure by now u realize the class is hard to play WELL on and survive.thief gets a lot of haters due to its playstyles and if listening to posters crys ull think u have top damage and sustain lol.

Once Uve ignored them what was said previously is true in that theif excels at using its mobility/ports to quickly engage in +1 fights as it’s 1v1 potential is garbage. Infiltrator arrow is great for reaching nodes fast for decap or for repositioning.choking gas is good for downed players to delay reviving.in wvw before mounts thiefs was great for scouting roaming etc due to mobility,mounts kinda made all classes decent at it lol.s/d is definitely more forgiving than d/p and whether to go DD is mostly preference. Staff DD is ur best bet for zergs atleast I find and s/d or d/p is ok for roaming just know that ur best bet is to always be aware of ur surroundings as thief can be downed in seconds by every class, stay back and pick and choose ur +1’s. Also u really don’t offer anything significant to ur allies so just follow zergs as u won’t get many invites. Have fun :)

> @"lare.5129" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > If u think thiefs damage is fine u obviously don’t play it,pls stop posting garbage on on class threads u don’t even play.

> I am sure that damage ir to much great. And no matter me or someone play it. To check it open sc board and look on top dps on small hitbox. And now on pvp skilled thief can chance to continue that and make burst for someone like on golem.

> Also be honest, and please not try common class question redirect to my or someone else personality.

>

Yeah pretty sure ur looking at old DE small hit box damage that’s outdated since couple DE nerfs,DD staff is good small hit box dps on a golem that stands there while being auto’d on and to add DD staff auto’s were nerfed in 2017,still good dps since it’s braindead auto spam but nothing special compared to other power classes so not sure what ur trying to say? U trying to say thief tops dps charts still?

> @"lare.5129" said:

> > @"getalifeturd.8139" said:

> > You are primarily talking about PvE as I've judged from most of your posts. People are generally talking about PvP when it comes to these discussions not against a stationary inanimate object that doesn't even fight back called a **golem.**

>

> Primarily I talking about possobility create damage. So I think it wrong, bus we have top damage place for tief.

> And how everyone can use and extent on pvp that damage, and make domination usign some factors - is personal skill, and only that. May be for raoming thief shoudl have alwasy teammate wiht some skills, may be need use some magic traits and tricks .. So current state is good for thief. And any changes is come should be only thief nerf to atract skilled people who love 'pain and gain'.

> Who scared - use necro in celelstian and don't worry about that.

>

> About pve - On pve I othen write 'no thiefs' and dont care what dps cout it is.

If u think thiefs damage is fine u obviously don’t play it,pls stop posting garbage on on class threads u don’t even play. Are u afraid they’ll someday get a dps buff and actually challenge ur class? In the last year I have yet to see or my self burst any class for any meaningful amount of damage using anything but MBS and staff vault. Top thief players who are far better than u or me are streaming their games calling out in real time the garbage damage as they outplay their opponent and see their go barely move,that’s with s/d and d/p yet on forums u get nonnthief players claiming they have all this damage yet no proof to show for obvious reasons lmao. I play a maurader build with zerk trinkets and infiltration runes and I do pittyfull damage on all my attacks whether it’s s/d,d/p,dd,and p/p unless it’s mbs or vault spam it’s garbage. When I play holo,soulbeast and guard I notice a huge increase in burst and dps as well all while not even prioritizing dps in the builds. Add to that much higher sustain and I’m very mobile on soulbeast.

Yeah shield skills are great right now no change needed

Ok :) cool I get it bad idea lol

Yeah gues be a lot o work lol just be interesting to see classes side by side but ur right

Yeah feel free to use zerker gear and assassins signet,than compare power zerker builds dps on other classes like soulbeast,warrior,holo etc :) and for record people will easily kno if ur full of shit with ur findings,never kno with people these days haha

> @"Fortus.6175" said:

> While I do find it funny that the person who made this post has played Mirage with Jaunt (which has pretty much all of these issues he described in his/her own thread) , I do agree that teleports are an issue as they are when coupled with unblockables/boon steal/iframes/high upfronted damage/stealth + damage.

>  

>  

> I have been saying this since beta, and Im sure if someone is bored enough to dig through my old posts (going back 6 years) will see that I have been saying the same thing over and over again:

>  

>  

> Mechanics that are one sided like the current implementation of stealth (where every other popular game in existence in the last few years have learned from this and made it more of a minigame for both sides, or give stealth drawbacks)

> and

> **Teleports** (which in here ignore **verticality and LoS** ) which gives an intangible advantage that can't be measured like healing/damage, but it is still very relevant and game changing, will create unbalances that are binary: either these classes are really strong, or really weak, no middle ground. No amount of number shifting will fix this because those things are fundamentally strong. Thieves have been in meta since beta, will continue to be in meta till the end of days until those things change.

>  

>  

>

> Sw/D thief is the biggest offender, which mind you, it is a core build (which has been powercreeped through traits that were changed to prioritize stability and many more things). Steal prioritizes stability and is unblockable, can daze, heal and is really low CD (should be an elite-long CD for all it does). Sword has #2 that ignore verticality and LoS, instant teleport and no CD, couple with #3, an unblockable high damage (!) skill that steals boons which prioritize rej and protection. For as long as builds like this and revs with their instant cast and damage exist, squishy classes without as many teleports/iframes (like mesmers) cannot and will not survive in any competitive manner (eles being always on the receiving end since beta, in fact, all ele builds that have been strong is because they were bunkerish, not squishy, unless we are talking about FA which again, is not healthy for the game and has never been competitive).

Lol so mirage being universally one of the best duellers will never be competitive because of a class universally known as a +1 class cuz it can’t 1v1 better than any class other than maybe Eli?lmao if u think s/d is powercrept u need to learn to play better wow. So is it op cuz it can tele to an already engaged opponent to help down it? Cuz pretty sure mirage has ports etc to do same and can do far better once enemy is engaged than a thief ever could,only reason thief still decapper over mirage is infilt arrow,mirage literally outclasses it as most other classes do at anything else. If ur dying 1v1 to any thief build u need practice hard lol

Warrior fine,Ele needs buffs

> @"Twilight Tempest.7584" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > Thief as a whole will never be at a spot line withe majority of other classes. **Due to its mechanics and playstyles it is the class that produces the most salty players and constant thief op cries** even when their garbage tier in most engagement scenarios these days the cries will keep coming. That combined with arena net not knowing much about their game,how each class players in each mode,and wanting to appease the masses thief will always struggle.just reroll another class like a lot of players have.

>

> I thought that was Mirage. :p (See months of multiple "mirage OP, nerf nao!" threads per day).

>

> Full disclosure: I'm somewhat sympathetic to thieves. My second character was a thief that I ended up playing a lot of open world content with. I enjoyed the play style so much I neglected my first character, a mesmer, for a while. But I never had the nerve to bring my thief to PvP because I had fallen in love with a niche, and apparently nerfed into unviability, minimal-stealth d/d build, that would be ineffective in competitive modes. And it looks like the profession as a whole hasn't seen any more love from Anet, rather the opposite.

>

> I never get salty about being beaten by a thief because they're usually good. Even the odd time a DE interferes with me while fighting someone else, it's annoying, but I understand that's the DE's role. I make sure not to let it happen again by focusing the DE next time (sorry @"Blur.3465" ).

U are in a very small minority man lol

Yeah makes little sense,must be a fun person to be around lol

Someone who’s good at making charts should make one depicting all the classes auto damages as well as standard skills damage with their added effects and equate their averages dps between thier weapon sets,also defensive capabilities such as evades,blocks and invulnerability skills etc, mobility skills and lastly boons they can grant themselves and how it effects their individual dps and sustain so players can really compare how each class stands up to the others

Thiefs burst is garbage compared to warrior,holo,guard and soulbeast all while having way more sustain as well as having sustained damage and far more forgiving playstyles.I kno cuz I play them very often. Yeah the who argument of thief is good other classes are the problem being powercrept,problem is arenanet does not have a habit of toning any part of the powercreep down in any meaningful way and doubt they ever will as the usually just keep adding positives to balance stuff out which clearly works great lol so where’s that leave thief? Also thief being left weak due to its mobility and mechanics is bull shit when most classes have mobility thrown at them over the last couple yrs making all of them slightly less mobile than thief with higher burst and blocks and invulnerability skills to boot. 3 yrs ago dps may have been decent on thief but aside from MBS etc dps is a joke vs the sustain of today

Using barrier and laughing at two hard hitting players is absolute hyperbole lmao I run maurader gear with durability runes on scrapper a lot last couple weeks and with barrier two hard hitting opponents will still down u fast and hard and be laughing at u. Yeah against a non zerk solo Roamer barrier can make u very sustainy but u definitely aren’t hitting like a holo,soulbeast or warrior lol and certainly not invincible.

Sadly this is true. Soulbeast can contribute to made small groups thru stance share but to zergs there’s way to many reflects etc going on, thief well it’s useless now in almost all game modes,warclaw kinda destroyed the scouting gig even though that was a pretty trivial job aswell lol but ranger u might atleast be able to dismount and have a good chance at duels which is fun but not a huge help to ur server.

Given the punishment of being hit as thief I agree with increased attack speed for sure on sword, staff also could use a boost,dust strike is slow and should drop a initiative point of cost so I’d be usefull in PvP. Vault after cast could be sped up to shave a little off the punishing frames as it’s easy for anyone to time their strikes when a thief uses vault. Weakening charge could definitely be sped up and the damage distributied between all hits especially if their never gonna fix the issue of going through the opponent even with melee assist on.thief does have crazy cc but some good stuns/dazes etc if s/d and pistol standard attacks actually rewarded thief for the set up with some decent dps MBS etc wouldn’t have to be rely’d on.

> @"lare.5129" said:

> > @"coopoor.2631" said:

> > we have w vs w which is follow the leader the game to me lacks competition on a guild lvl an thats to me is sad

> Then I come from job I want have in relax mode www run with lead or jon sPvp .. so it is very ok.

> For people who want skill domination, pain and gain, and versus, exist word - "www roaming". And thief is good choose for that.

> Ofc I think thief should be have some nerf, dual pistol should not stack might so fast, ant etc, but his is another story.

>

Lmao duel pistol nerf, thief should be glass but not as good as a warrior at fighting,thief should be hard mode? U either are trolling or have far less grasp of the game than u think and shouldn’t be posting. U come across like yeah thief should be glassy and hard to play as it is,nerf pistol/pistol (no one uses cuz it’s garbage in PvP)

Sry but ur post ridiculous.

> @"mortrialus.3062" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > Well mirage has a hefty kit itself compared to warrior though I don’t think mirage is that op these days either so. I will admit I played thief non stealth veriety over last few yrs and ever since I switched to engi,guard and ranger spec variants I’ll admit I may have been overstating in my mind how op the other specs were, now they don’t seem so op lol warrior just seems a little too durable and as far as mirage some of the insta Condi clone spam burst were far to high, never considered power mirage too crazy op though

>

> I literally two shot people on Spellbreaker.

That may be but I run holo most of the time so I feel wrong calling out any class as op these days

Well mirage has a hefty kit itself compared to warrior though I don’t think mirage is that op these days either so. I will admit I played thief non stealth veriety over last few yrs and ever since I switched to engi,guard and ranger spec variants I’ll admit I may have been overstating in my mind how op the other specs were, now they don’t seem so op lol warrior just seems a little too durable and as far as mirage some of the insta Condi clone spam burst were far to high, never considered power mirage too crazy op though

> @"Blur.3465" said:

> > @"omgdracula.6345" said:

> > This thread should just be closed. You all acting like stealth is just infinitely spammable on thief when it has costs to it, or getting bursted 100 to 0 by a thief from stealth which isn't possible unless you are just super bad at this game and have 0 knowledge of thief.

>

> Thank you for the voice of reason!

>

> And there will always be QQ about stealth and asking for nerfs. Thief in general simply has to suffer for it :/

This so much ^

I don’t much like the DE playstyle as I found it was heavily balanced with ease of access to stealth as well as a longer duration of it thru easy stacking etc.being a thief player who never really enjoyed the stealth playstyle part of thief but enjoyed all other mechanics of thief and it’s theme DE never seemed to have survivability outside of stealth builds by design. I have no problems with stealth itself or people that enjoy the playstyle as everyone enjoys different things. What I do have a problem with is while most classes were getting powercrept with dps,mobility and sustain thief never got same treatment or compensated for most classes being buffed in the area’s that thief would call its strenths. It seems like arenanet figures they didn’t have to cuz a thief spec can already permastealth and burst down players in seconds with rifle or with a back stab out of nowhere so because of this the class was strong enough but what about non stealth thiefs? Thieves ran around in wvw etc perma stealth backstabbing players leading to more thief is op posts even though dps on non stealthing thieves were garbage.Than rifle burst got nerfed along side more nerds also effecting core/Dd. Finally now stealth duration is nerfed lmao it’s just getting to the point of being amusing how clueless arenet is with the direction their taking thief all while people still claim it’s op out of a biased hate for the class

I think warriors sustain is a bit high but they should hit hard,thier a warrior after all. When I think warrior I think hard hitting,ok mobility and good sustain. Right now the can hit hard, good mobility and great sustain, that said thier definitely not crazy op or anyything

The feeling of a good fight or small group melee battle feels far better than spamming ranged attacks while trying to avoid all the ridiculous garbage aoe brainless spam scourges are puking out or defending or taking a camp, rewards for dealing with zergs are trivial lol

> @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > @"UNOwen.7132" said:

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > Compensation is one of many solutions ... and it's not one we see Anet provide. Better set your sights on something else.

> > >

> > > I'm not saying Deadeye isn't in need of a buff, but it's not likely going to come in the form of compensation with the goal of getting it's status back for PVP. That's just not how we see things work in this game.

> >

> > > @"Obtena.7952" said:

> > > Compensation is one of many solutions ... and it's not one we see Anet provide. Better set your sights on something else.

> > >

> > > I'm not saying Deadeye isn't in need of a buff, but it's not likely going to come in the form of compensation with the goal of getting it's status back for PVP. That's just not how we see things work in this game.

> >

> > Again, Anet has compensated for nerfs immideatly plenty of times before. It is something they do. Unfortunately, thief is a class that Anet doesnt seem to be very fond of, getting constant unneccessary (and in fact, counterproductive) nerfs for no reason. It seems they are adamant to make sure that if a thief gets into a 1v1 against another class, no matter how good the thief is, they are going to lose.

>

> I think you aren't being honest with yourself here. Anet will change something they think doesn't work the way they want; they will not simply compensate for something they took away in one area, just to make up for it in another. Anet does not make these changes because they intend to 'ignore' the class or for no reason, so if that's your position on things, there is little value in you responding.

>

> There are lots of hints here in the last patch about how Anet feels about some of the inbalance of risk/reward that exists in the competitive game modes; Compensation simply doesn't make sense where re-calibration was the goal.

Lmao yes arenanet makes balance decisions based on a very clear goal and through their vast knowledge of their own game and it’s mechanics have proven this time and time again with their very concise and well thought out changes that most definitely follow through with thier disigned goals. I mean just look at the thief game description,couldn’t be more closer the thief we have now. Lol right? They definitely put a lot of thought and reasoning behind their changes lol right? All the changes to the classes and mode over last few years shows they have a great grasp of thier game right? Donno bout that. Look at thir reasoning for necro being left alone in PvP, it had a healthy playerbase so it must be fine lmao what? The class has cool flavour in its theme and skills and is always a highly populated class even when underperforming and win rates are dependent on the whole group not an individual class in a PvP conquest mode so..... yeah arenets logic is solid!