Teratus.2859

Dunno why some of you guys want Primordus redeemed, if anything I want him to be exactly what we expect him to be.. a being of pure destruction and evil. We already had this redemption not it's fault thing with Kralkatorrik, no need to do that again specially with Primordus. We've already got Jormag playing the "im not bad really" card while clearly being a bad dragon. For Primordus I want to be dealing with essentially a pure evil, living nuclear bomb who's only agenda is to watch the world burn. That to me makes him far, far more dangerous than any other enemy we've had in Gw2, including the other Elder Dragons and I want to see that represented in the game with us feeling almost completely useless and outclassed compared to him. We came close to something like that with Kralkatorrik but in the end it was just setback after setback. With Primordus they need to go all the way.. like Smaug in the hobbit when he just flies off and destroys lake town while the heros can do nothing but watch the carnage completely helpless to do anything.. I hope we get something like that with Primordus where we see the cost of our failure through the carnage and destruction he wages on the world and the regret that we once spared his life really kicks us in the gut. I want Dragon's Watch to be brought to the absolute brink of giving up and accepting the end of the world due to witnessing the sheer power of Primordus.

If anything it should be Ranger high Thief middle Engineer low Engi is way too tanky and slippery to warrant high hp, go fight them in pvp and wvw if you need proof of that, they are almost equally as durable as all those super revenants running about soloing small groups.

Tbh this has annoyed me a bit for years after I realised it was a thing. Yes there should be a high HP medium armour class and while many say it should be Engineer I say it should be Ranger due to the fact that Engineers are already capable of making highly durable and slippery builds. Engineer would be too OP with a health buff, Ranger would not alas Ranger deserves it more.

Necro's have the worst mobility in the game.. it is their biggest weakness as a class. If you're fighting Necros with "crazy mobility" then chances are you're probably fighting a hacker with speed mods because Necros suck when it comes to mobility as they should. Watching that video btw, 100% a speed hacker which is clearly evident by the way their character moves, what looks like a series of quickstep teleports instead of fluid movement. Nerfing Necros mobility would do nothing but screw over legit players.

As I said in another thread the clues dropped in this latest episode suggest to me that Jormag is going to die either during this saga or very early into End of Dragons and the unified Spirits of the wild will through Braham absorb the magic unleashed by Jormag's death. How Jormag will die.. I am not 100% certain yet but my gut tells me that the finale of the saga will see Jormag and Primordus clash in a large battle. Ultimately the outcome of this event will be decided by Braham. This is my speculation on how this event may play out. I have a feeling that Jormag and Primordus will be evenly matched by this point however Ryland is going to play a big part in Jormag's army for this battle and will act as a sort of trump card for Jormag. I think our part in this fight will start off being forced into helping Ryland against Primordus but towards the end as he's about to enact his attack and either kill Primordus or cripple him so Jormag can finish him off, we decide we cannot allow Ryland to go through with it as killing either of the dragons will be very bad for the world thus we try to stop Ryland leading to a fight between us and Ryland as the 2 dragons continue their battle. After defeating Ryland (but not killing him) we are now desperately trying to find away to end this situation without killing either of the dragons when Ryland catches a second wind and attempts to murder either the commander or one of our allies in the fight.. (Either Crecia or Rytlock is my guess) Braham acting on pure instinct in the heat of the moment defends his allies and kills Ryland before he can complete his attack. Jormag who sense's the death of her champion is momentarily distracted and weakened, angered by Rylands death focus's it's attention onto us giving Primordus the opening it needed to deal a lethal blow to Jormag. Knowing that it has won and it's sibling is fatally wounded with no hope or survival, Primordus retreat's back into the ground leaving Jormag to die of it's wounds. At this point we and Aurine share one final conversation with the Ice dragon before it dies. As Jormag's energy is released Braham backed by all the spirits of the wild throws himself into the blast absorbing Jormag's magic and transferring it to the spirits averting the end of the world. With another Dragon dead our attention turns sorely to Primordus who is now free of his sibling and more powerful than ever before.. we decide we have no choice but to find away to kill Primordus as well which eventually leads us into End of Dragons where both Primordus and the Sea Dragon will die and likely be replaced by Kuunavang and Albax. A possible end scenario is that once the old Elder's are gone the New Elder Dragon's along with the Spirits of the Wild fear that the power they now possess will one day attract challenges by other powerful beings who may seek to usurp them and throw the world into chaos again, thus they decide that it is in the best interests of Tyria if they do what the human Gods did and leave Tyria to go where no one will ever find them. As they leave Aurine says her farewells telling us that she loves us more than she can express and thanks us for everything before she too leaves the world and probably does something really corny like leaves a shining star in the sky like in one of those old cheesy movies lol

> @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > There's a big difference between fearless and foolishly reckless though, Dwarves are not mindless drones that would throw their lives away needlessly. > > They would fall back if they felt it would give them an advantage or if it was simply the best course of action. > Actually, there were strong suggestions even back in GW1, that once they've engaged the enemy, they are no longer capable of "tactical withdrawal". Yes, it does make them dangerously reckless. They've became unyelding like the stone they turned into - and a stone does not retreat. I don't recall any such statement, then again it's easily possible they could have changed over the 250 years between games if those statements were true. There were plenty of reckless Dwarves even before the change so chances are this was more of a temporary state of mind in the collective consciousness as the first Stone Dwarves were mainly warriors who likely thought themselves near invincible after the change. With the addition of scholars and wiser dwarven minds into the collective they have no doubt changed over time.

There are a few factors in play. First of all the Dwarves as others have said have been keeping him occupied underground for a very very long time and until recently have managed to stalemate the majority of his minions over that time. However they are now starting to loose this battle as Primordus has become significantly more powerful. Secondly.. well I just said it but Primordus has become significantly more powerful due to the death's of Zhaitan, Mordrmeoth and Kralkatorrik and has modified himself with some of their abilities, the most notable being this new power seemingly from Kralkatorrik aka the feedback loop with his minions. The more his minions burn the stronger Primordus becomes and the stronger Primordus become the stronger and more rabid his minions become.. We also know Jormag appears to have this same ability now with the Frozen.. the more it freezes the stronger it gets as well. So knowing that Primordus becomes stronger by having his minions burn and destroy.. this explains their new appearances and behaviour on the surface. The Dwarves as said are now loosing the battle with Primordus so they too are being pushed back to the surface to join forces with the anti-dragon factions that seek to end Primordus. So to answer your question as simply as possible.. Why is his second awakening this cycle so much more of a threat? Well it's because he is far more powerful than he was 200 years ago and has new abilities that he didn't have 200 years ago, he is now winning the fight against the only faction that was standing in his way and he gets even more powerful based on how much destruction and burninating the countryside he does. Props if you get that reference XD

> @"Astralporing.1957" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > It makes sense for them to come back now since Primordus is waking.. turning the tide on them and driving them up to the surface. > That's actually going against the lore. The transformation caused some psychological changes within the dwarven race - specifically stone dwarves are supposed to be completely fearless and unyelding. They would not have allowed themselves to be driven to surface - they would have fought to the last dwarf to stop destroyers from coming back up. > > In fact, we've been told at some point that more destroyers seem to appear on the surface lately is a sign that the dwarves are probably already close to being extinct (seeing as they've been fighting unceaselessly and dying for the last 250 years, and can't increase their numbers anymore). There's a big difference between fearless and foolishly reckless though, Dwarves are not mindless drones that would throw their lives away needlessly. They would fall back if they felt it would give them an advantage or if it was simply the best course of action. Ogden has also been on the surface for years and is their connection to the going's on above so they very likely know about everything that's occurred up there for the past decade.. namely the deaths of the other Dragons and the unified efforts to get rid of the remaining ones. Retreating to the surface and joining forces with the various factions fighting the dragons is something they probably though't they would have to do eventually, the reason it's taken so long is probably because until recently they were managing to hold their own without the aid of others.. but now that Primordus has become so much more powerful they can no longer hold him back alone.

> @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said: > > @"Fenella.2634" said: > > > @"Konig Des Todes.2086" said: > > > > @"Fenella.2634" said: > > > > Well, alright, I also was not aware it was actually established lore from GW1 that bodies had to be in a reasonably good shape. :) > > > > > > > > However, that whole argument aside. What also sets apart the PC from most other resurrections in the GW universe, is that the PC did not become Risen, Awakened, a necromancer's minion or any other kind of undead. Even with resurrections being a thing in this universe, death always matters. Our circumstances were very, very special and unique. I don't suppose other characters could easily find their own Eater of Souls to kill, plus a deal with an Avatar of Grenth to make. > > > > So, even if Trahearne, Vlast or anyone else could somehow manage to get a body back, they would most likely not return like the PC did, but as an undead. Do we really want that? Maybe it's better to let them rest in peace. > > > > > > While you are correct that the Commander's circumstances were very unique, no resurrection results in undeath of any form simply because of the spellcaster/school of magic/magical energy involved. In GW1, resurrection spells belonged exclusively to healer classes - monks, ritualists, and paragons - which seem to utilize the school of Preservation (and mechanically, used holy/light energy)- all three also merged into the Guardian; meanwhile, undeath spells belonged exclusively to the necromancer profession (no surprise), which utilized the school of Aggression (and mechanically, dark/unholy energy). So the Commander not becoming undead is rather "the very same as all other resurrections in the GW universe". > > Wait, player gameplay deaths are canon deaths? I always thought they were just unconscious or something and the resurrection spells were not exactly resurrections. > > It's a blurry area. [Reyna](https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Reyna) has dialogue talking about how the group died, lampshading the henchmen AI. So it's presumable that it has occurred in canon. > > _"Remember all those times we were dying and I was the only one left standing but I used my signet on Alesia instead of you only to have her die while attempting to restore Lina's life? Yeah, good times. Good times."_ > > But those spells existing is indeed canon, as they're even mentioned [in the Battle for Khylo short story](https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/The_Battle_for_Kyhlo). > > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > Hmm.. > > I'm going to throw this one out there but I don't think the physical "condition" of the corpse is as relevant as some of you have been arguing about here. > > > > Thinking back on Gw1.. Minions were a thing and back then they used and were made from corpses, so you could die and your corpse could have been defiled to create minions and you could still be resurrected despite your spine and muscular system running around smacking things, you simply get new ones XD > > I know this is just a mechanical thing but lets just consider it for the sake of argument. > > > > When you die in these games your soul finds it's way to the mists, I would say that this natural process is basically the time limit for resurrection before your soul becomes part of the mists and there is no longer enough life in your body for you to be resurrected. > > Once the Soul is gone for too long, resurrection becomes almost impossible. > > In Gw1 resurrection magic was very common as Konig has pointed out several times and yet there were still deaths in the game which all ultimately shared a common circumstance. > > That being there were no friendly beings around to revive them in time.. so they died for good. > > Gadd, Togo, and Ahtok had several allies nearby to revive them. Ahtok dies right in front of us, even, with no immediate pressure to not resurrect. But they still died permanently. Gadd and Ahtok died via explosion - their bodies were no doubt _highly_ mangled (Ahtok's doesn't look so for obvious mechanical reasons). If he was able to, I feel confident that Vekk would have resurrected Gadd - Gadd still had a body to be cremated, so it wasn't outright gone. > > And if being made undead doesn't prevent resurrection in lore, then why do no undead get "unkilled" and resurrected? > > So it stands to reason that there is a "point of no return" for how mangled a body can be and still be viable for resurrection. The question is mostly just _where is that point_? > > The only real confirmations about "what's beyond that point" would be "exploded body" and "rotten body". A relatively intact corpse does seem to play some role although there are some contradictions at play when you factor in the minion mechanic which defiles a corpse.. although it is largely left intact in a manner of speaking. I think rotten body could easily be attributed with time past and the "lack of life" left in a corpse. But I don't think you're wrong about the exploded body element, although how much of a body is required for resurrection is a whole other question. Can someone with one arm be revived? one leg? do you only need the major vital organs? if a body was blown apart but you were able to recover the head and torso would that be enough? Would a dismembered body have an even shorter resurrection time than an intact corpse?.. as life could leave it quicker or something.. I dunno, but I think vaporisation is a definite nope.. and with Gadd at least if they were able to bury something it stands to reason that they couldn't find enough of him in time to revive him. Togo I believe you said was used to fuel the resurrection of Shiro so I assume Shiro used all the life that was in his body to do this thus resurrection was impossible. I must admit I don't remember Ahtok though, I have very little memory of Nightfall and haven't played it in a long time. It is said on his wiki page though his soul was sent to the realm of torment.. not the underworld so that could have been why he couldn't be resurrected as his spirit was not under the dominion of Grenth who allowed resurrection but rather Abaddon.

> @"Fueki.4753" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > The Spirits are the ones most interesting in this scenario.. will they absorb this power and become even more powerful than they are? or will they follow in Owl's footsteps and sacrifice themselves to absorb Jormag's magic and save the world?.. that's the real question. > > > > So yeah, I think Owl just dropped us a big hint that the Spirits of the Wild can/will allow us to kill another Elder Dragon by taking the "hit" so to speak when their magic is unleashed. > The spirits, as a group, could also become the replacement for Jormag (and possibly Primordus). > That's pretty much what I was getting at yes, or will they sacrifice themselves to eliminate the power entirely.. Im leaning far more towards the former of those options as well but I won't rule out the possibility of them sacrificing themselves to kill Jormag once and for all.

> @"Sajuuk Khar.1509" said: > > @"Fenella.2634" said: > > Also it is a bit sad Owl is now dead. I was hoping to see more of her but guess death is a better fate than being corrupted to a Elder Dragon. > Don't forget Owl's cryptic comment about the Spirit's being able to guide the fall. > This one line has convinced me that we will see another Dragon die by the end of Icebrood Saga or very early in End of Dragons. And that Dragon will likely be Jormag. Aurine also mentioned in this episode that another opportunity will present itself and it was said that both Dragons will need to be dealt with. Braham also being the Norn of Prophecy a "harness" as owl put it, destined to kill or be killed by Jormag.. So what does that tell me? The combined Spirits of the Wild will be able absorb the magic unleashed by Jormag's Death by using Braham as a catalyst to absorb it. Back in Gw1 we saw Kormir absorb the power of a God thanks to the aid of the 7 Human Gods, so we know a mortal can absorb a massive amount of magical energy under the right circumstances and ascend from that infusion of magic. I do not think Braham will become a God in any way Im just using Kromir as an example to a similar but different event. I do think he may become something different, a Norn of great power perhaps but nothing too ridiculous, he'll very much remain a mortal man, he'll just be a bit more than the average Norn which he kinda already is anyway being the Norn of Prophecy and all. The Spirits are the ones most interesting in this scenario.. will they absorb this power and become even more powerful than they are? or will they follow in Owl's footsteps and sacrifice themselves to absorb Jormag's magic and save the world?.. that's the real question. So yeah, I think Owl just dropped us a big hint that the Spirits of the Wild can/will allow us to kill another Elder Dragon by taking the "hit" so to speak when their magic is unleashed.

> @"deatine.2498" said: > I always wondered: Sylvari sometimes say about other dead Sylvari "they are with our mother again" or something like that. And we know memories and thoughts of Sylvari can be accessed through the dream by each other, or at least by the mother tree, even if just vaguely. > > If it is actually true that the afterlife for Sylvari (normally) means returning to the dream, can they simply be reborn into another body? > > The whole species is like what, 30 years old? Not that many Sylvari have actually died. Necromancer/resurrection lore from before the Sylvaris' existence might not apply to them. This is actually one thing I want the Devs to explore more in the game. Where do they go after death?.. Sylvari commanders still went to the Domain of the Lost which suggest's they may go to the mists like other races do and also confirms they have a soul/spirit energy like other mortal races do that allows them to manifest there as spirits. It's not something that's explained.. well at all tbh and it's something I'd like Anet to flesh out sometime. As far as resurrection lore goes I would say it probably could apply had they been around back then, the magic didn't appear to be effected by race since res spells would work on Humans, Norn, Dwarves, Tengu, Asura, Golems, Insects, Animals, Demons.. just about anything really so Sylvari would likely have been able to be resurrected if the magic still existed. Plus there's the fact that the Commander was able to do it even as a Sylvari which would make him/her the first of their race to be resurrected to our knowledge. Not including the Awakened Sylvari that Joko managed to reanimate.. though that's not quite the same thing as resurrection as I pointed out in my last post.

> @"Pifil.5193" said: > > @"Randulf.7614" said: > > I wouldn't expect much either. The dwarves were very much a bit part. The Tengu will likely be a 1 DRM cameo + EOTN NPC as well > > Yeah, the dwarves are just "there" all of a sudden, gone for hundreds of years and then just back without fanfare or ceremony. Centuries of absence just hand waved away so they can rush an expansion out. It's sad. > They weren't expected back that's why, they've been underground for so long most people probably thought they were long gone by now, some probably don't even believe they existed at all. It makes sense for them to come back now since Primordus is waking.. turning the tide on them and driving them up to the surface.

> @"voltaicbore.8012" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > Charr are not humans, for the most part they don't care about feelings, especially foolish and self harming ones (by their perspective) > > Randulf is correct that this is a cultural difference and there's plenty of that in race as well as between races, even in reality between nations etc > > Can't expect everyone to think and feel the same way.. that wouldn't be a good thing at all and would cheapen the world. > > > > What would be the point of having Charr, Human, Sylvari, Norn, Asura, Grawl, Hylek, Kodan, Tengu etc etc if they were all the same? > > Their differences is what makes the whole working together thing so interesting. > > You completely missed the point. I wasn't taking issue with the fact that there are differences. I had a problem with what I thought was the writing very clearly judging (quite negatively, I might add) the Ebonhawke skeptics for being different from Crecia. Why?.. that's perfectly in line with a Charr attitude and Crecia's personality. It would have been completely out of character for her to have set aside her own opinions to consider their feelings.. Charr rarely do this in general, especially Soldiers.. it's considered a weakness that could get them killed. In her eyes the people were being stupid and bigoted and risking their lives based on foolish feelings. I would completely expect a Charr of all people to criticise that, even mock it.. which is what she did. >That being said, there's still a remarkable lack of sympathy for a people who live as a minority far from their home civilization, as refugees suffering generations of physical attack from people who don't want them there. I find that to be a poor narrative choice. It's not really that far.. sure location wise it is but the two cities are connected via a direct Asura gate.. anyone can go between cities as they please really. It's well known now that Ascalon lands belong to the Charr, Humans were the original invaders and drove them out. (thanks to Balthazar I think who encouraged them to fight the beasts in the North and take their lands) In the Charr's eyes they were completely justified in their war on humans and taking back their lands. They saw humans as invaders, as monsters who would skin their kind and wear their skin as armour (humans legitimately did that). And Humans saw Charr as savage beasts who would slaughter them and eat them (Charr legitimately did that too). Both sides did horrible things to one another in the many long years they were at war. But that war is over now and the Charr have largely accepted that and moved on outside of a few radical factions like the Renegades which the Legions have completely disavowed, declared enemies of the legion's and actively aided in wiping them out for years. Add to that Bangar's recent uprising and aiming to bring back the Glory days of the Charr.. another radical Charr faction that the Charr went to war with to destroy. If you had spent a decade fighting your own kind, watching friends and bandmates die to uphold a treaty with people who then when under attack would rather spend their time worrying about you coming to help them and not trusting you then yeah.. you would also think they're acting like foolish idiots who would rather let their own people die than allow you, their official ally.. to enter their city and help them. You'd also be pretty offended to realise that everything you have done to uphold that peace treaty made no difference to these people because they still don't trust you or want you in their city after 10 years of peace and co-operation, (Human and Charr soldiers have been fighting enemy factions together since the treaty was signed) I'm not saying there isn't any justifications for how the humans felt after all those years having do deal with Renegades and Charr like Bangar.. not to mention Human Separatists as well. But to expect the Charr to care about those feelings is way too much to ask.. especially after this much time has passed. The Charr moved on.. Humans didn't. It's easy for a human to say the Charr should care about how humans feel after their violent history. But then it would also be fair for a Charr to say Humans should move on and get over it already. Neither of them is right or wrong to think or feel that way.

Charr are not humans, for the most part they don't care about feelings, especially foolish and self harming ones (by their perspective) Randulf is correct that this is a cultural difference and there's plenty of that in race as well as between races, even in reality between nations etc Can't expect everyone to think and feel the same way.. that wouldn't be a good thing at all and would cheapen the world. What would be the point of having Charr, Human, Sylvari, Norn, Asura, Grawl, Hylek, Kodan, Tengu etc etc if they were all the same? Their differences is what makes the whole working together thing so interesting.

Hmm.. I'm going to throw this one out there but I don't think the physical "condition" of the corpse is as relevant as some of you have been arguing about here. Thinking back on Gw1.. Minions were a thing and back then they used and were made from corpses, so you could die and your corpse could have been defiled to create minions and you could still be resurrected despite your spine and muscular system running around smacking things, you simply get new ones XD I know this is just a mechanical thing but lets just consider it for the sake of argument. When you die in these games your soul finds it's way to the mists, I would say that this natural process is basically the time limit for resurrection before your soul becomes part of the mists and there is no longer enough life in your body for you to be resurrected. Once the Soul is gone for too long, resurrection becomes almost impossible. In Gw1 resurrection magic was very common as Konig has pointed out several times and yet there were still deaths in the game which all ultimately shared a common circumstance. That being there were no friendly beings around to revive them in time.. so they died for good. In Gw2 this resurrection magic has been lost because Grenth and Dwayna have left Tyria and resurrection was largely possible because of those two Gods. I believe the resurrection magic itself largely came from Dwayna but it was Grenth that allowed fresh souls to leave the mists and return to their bodies while it was still possible. In regards to Dhuum, he actually wished to stop this practice as he hated the concept of resurrection and ruthlessly hunted down those who cheated death.. the greatest of insults that he took very personally. This mechanically took form in his Gw1 fight as well as defeated players were not allowed to resurrect and their souls were instantly torn from their bodies and became spirits which had to continue the fight in their dead form. Without Dwayna and Grenth resurrection is now extremely rare magic. And as has been said the Commander's circumstances were special as well. We ended up in the Domain of the Lost rather than the afterlife we were meant to go to due to the circumstances of our death. We were able to speak to and learn of a possible way to resurrect ourselves from The Judge, one of the last servants of Grenth. We were able to harvest the life force of a powerful "living" Demonic creature to fuel our resurrection after we had been dead for too long. So the requirements appear to be. You need a corpse to go back too.. in the case of Vlast and Traherne this wasn't an option, Vlast blew up and Traherne was physically corrupted and mutated.. had he been resurrected he would have been revived in the same state he was and would probably have died again due to the dead, rotting dragon he was connected too. There also needs to be enough life in your body or you must find an adequate living substitute in the afterlife (a Demon or living being) and take that life energy, while we were able to do this in the story this is not something most would be able to accomplish very easily or even have the option of trying in most case's. I think it may also be important to note the difference between resurrection and reanimation as well. Resurrection magic appears to restore the body and the soul upon revival, This is why the Commander is not an Undead being and is very much alive and not decaying. Reanimation revives the corpse in a state of undeath under the control of a "master" being and can be done with or without the soul, like the Awakened. Honestly the odd one out here is Aurine since the circumstances of her "resurrection" was the very very very bad excuse of "Lich magic" By all rights she should be an undead being since Lich Magic is strongly speculated to be associated with Necromancy but these kinds of arguments have been had many times in the past and there's no point getting into all that again. Lich's in the Guildwars franchise are far far to poorly explained and there is far far too little information and lore about them despite them having such prominent roles in some of this franchises campaigns.. This is one of the reasons why so many of us were so annoyed by the whole "Lich Magic" excuse for Aurine's revival in the first place. Once this whole Elder Dragon story is over and we can see Gw2 go in new directions then I am heavily in favour of exploring and fleshing out Lich's in this franchise, as well as Demons and diving more into the afterlife concepts. These areas are all high interests for me personally and I want to know more about them and experience them more in game.

I'm excited for the continuing story but that's about it.

> @"Threather.9354" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > But here's a simple suggestion, if you don't like the map, don't play on it.. it's that easy and plenty of people do that already. > > It is still 1 map less to play. Lets say there would be only 1 map to choose from compared to 3 at the moment, it would be much worse. So the issue of its existance isn't solved by simply "don't play it". You say 3 maps are plenty to choose from? Well frankly it isn't as desert map owner might be the server that can provide you fights in current timezone. 99% of the time if you go to bait them to fight on desert map, they either camp the lord rooms with the overpowered CC lords (sometimes unintentionally because running from spawn is about time it takes to get to lord room from breaching outer and inner walls), don't scout you at all before you manage to flip whole map or don't show up at all cuz they hate the map. > > If they really want to keep it, what they should do is redesign desert map as neutral map then throw it alongside EB. And give everyone alpine borderlands as home map. Then you have 5 maps. Alpine/EB likers have 4 to choose from again. Mapcaps will be less meaning less lag and 60 man laggy blob 1 shot fiesta terrible fights won't occur. People can cap things to build numbers easier because its little bit harder to stay active on 5 maps, so less objective camping. And 80% of pop can still dislike desert map or its activity and never go there again. Popularity of WvW goes against that, there's just not enough people playing most of the time to justify the server requirements for a 5th map, hell some could argue there isn't enough to justify 4.. Or even 3 if you want to cut the dupe Alpine. I'm not going to claim Desert is perfect or anything though, it certainly has issues like any other map but at least it's different from the bland and boring Alpine maps. You'll never get rid of the blob mentality in WvW though, that's never going away because people like it and it's easy.

The Alpine maps are among the ugliest and most boring and stale maps in the entire game. I'd rather have 3 edge of the mist maps or 3 Desert Borderlands maps than have any duplicates of the Alpine maps. The Desert Borderlands is.. or more accurately was a breath of fresh air when it was released, regardless of it's issues i'm glad it's here and will gladly defend it's existence. WvW already suffers from an extreme case of tedium and fatigue.. the last thing it needs is less unique maps, if anything it needs more of them. But here's a simple suggestion, if you don't like the map, don't play on it.. it's that easy and plenty of people do that already.

> @"Fenella.2634" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > > @"Sajuuk Khar.1509" said: > > > * The Nightmare Court? Largely done. There will be holdouts of any group like that, but the losses they took in core, LWS1, and HoT, would have pushed thier already few numbers into the tank. > > It's unknown how many losses they took, a lot of Nightmare Court resisted Mordremoth as well. > > Their biggest loss however was loosing Faolin which left them leaderless.. although a group like this you would expect to recover over time so while they are not a major threat now they could be again in the future. > Not quite. They have a new leader, she is there after the DS meta and has a bit of dialog. Doesn't appear to be overly antagonistic. The new Nightmare Court could develop into some sort of allied faction, if needed. I don't remember that. edit: You're referring to Duchess Chrysanthea right? She's not technically the leader, or wasn't back then at least. She may have arisen to the role since HoT but we can't know that until there's new story or news involving the Court. She maybe the last Duchess of the court left though.. don't know for sure. But the leader of the court is known by the Grand Duchess title.. or for males I would assume Grand Duke..

> @"Sajuuk Khar.1509" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > That's the thing though, Bangar knew what he was doing.. he knew he was being manipulated > Except he didn't. In fact, he explicitly says he believed he WASN'T being manipulated, but with how everything turned out, wonders if he was the whole time. > > https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bangar_Ruinbringer#During_the_Confer_with_Bangar_achievement > Player: You think Jormag always just meant to use you? > Bangar: I don't know... You asked me before this, I would have said no chance. No one "mind-controls" Bangar Ruinbringer. But the way it played out... Was there an inflection point, a specific moment when...? If there was, I didn't know. I never felt for one second like my mind wasn't my own. But... I heard the whispers. Maybe that's all it takes. > I read it somewhere but I can't remember where exactly.. he knew that Jormag was saying what he wanted to hear or something like that.. he was aware of the attempts to manipulate him that's probably why he thought he wasn't being manipulated when he actually was. I can't recall where I saw that though, pretty sure it's in game dialogue or something but don't take my word for it. > >And Human's.. well a good bunch of them decided to revive the White Mantle > They never revived the White Mantle. The Mantle was never gone, they just ran off into the jungle at the end of GW1, and largely stayed there beyond sneding agents to try to manipulate Kryta. Yes but they grew back into power, that's the point. They were able to recruit and manipulate people and successfully gain very high positions of power within human society. When Balthazar reappeared a great deal of his followers blindly followed him to war as well. Point is, whenever there is a power in the world that offers people what they view as a "good deal" or a "noble cause" there are always going to be those foolish enough to follow it no matter how many obvious red flags it sends up for everyone else. There's always people like that and you can bet if Jormag comes on down and starts "preaching" to humans it will seduce a good number of them with it's lies and promises.. Jormag would not be as dangerous as it is if it couldn't pull that off. > >Because we don't know where it is and it hasn't been making a problem of itself outside of some minor incidents. > We know its down near Cantha Actually we don't, we know that it is somewhere in the ocean but not where it is exactly. This discussion has been had many times on the forums with various arguments but nothing official regarding the dragon's location has been confirmed yet. > >Plus there's still the whole Killing Dragons dooms the world problem that has still not been addressed yet. > That's not really been an issue in regards to possibly killing Jormag and Primordus. It's something people bring up a lot in discussions though, atm killing them isn't really being discussed in game outside of Braham's destiny thing.. either he does or Jormag does. But a serious discussion about how to kill them and what will happen has yet to occur in game although Jormag has only recently awoke and prior to that our goal was't killing it, it was preventing it's awakening which we failed to do. So this is a discussion I expect our characters to have with Aurine in the near future when it's set in stone for our characters that we are going to be fighting both dragons to the death and there are no other options. > @"draxynnic.3719" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > And Human's.. well a good bunch of them decided to revive the White Mantle.. another bunch decided to follow Balthazar on a suicidal end of the world mission. > > I have no doubts what so ever that a human faction of Jormag followers would be extremely likely if Jormag was able to spread it's influence that far south.. which is what I suspect it is trying to do in the upcoming release. > > Jormag need only broadcast to Divinity's Reach it's messages of peace, protection and friendship and you'd see a bunch of foolish humans buy it, i'd put good money on that lol > > I don't think this is quite the same situation, though. The White Mantle had an established insurrection that had been present since their overthrow in GW1, while Balthazar's priesthood was an established institution in Kryta and his living (as opposed to Forged) followers seemed to be fairly few even then. Bangar, similarly, was an established authority figure, and he presented his effort as controlling Jormag rather than serving him. Considering the level of persuasion Jormag has already been shown to do, I wouldn't rule it out, but I don't think the precedents suggest that Jormag is suddenly going to get a significant level of support from the human population. Heck, we might be seeing the first signs of trouble happening in Lake Doric specifically _because_ those humans most susceptible to demagoguery have been weeded out and they refuse to cooperate. > It's not the same no but it's human nature want to believe in something more powerful than them. If Aurine showed up in DR preaching protection and friendship people would listen and they would do the same if Jormag did it on the same grounds. Jormag could have attacked and wiped us out.. but instead offered us peace and friendship, maybe it's not so bad after all and we were wrong about it... there's always people who think that way and succumb to the manipulation of malevolent forces. > I'd also note, in the Dominion's case, there was mention that after what went down at the Frost Citadel, those Dominion who weren't already transformed started going "Hell no!" and surrendering. > Some of them got that kick in the tail they needed lol But there were those who still choose to become corrupted, it's much like the flame legion in the past as well, you always get those kinds of people, fanatics and zealots for a cause they believe in. > I will note, though, that I think a large part of the reason for going to Cantha will be to find more friendly dragons so that the burden of regulating magic isn't entirely on Aurene. Yeah this is a popular prediction that I also find likely as well. Guess we just have to wait and see, atm there isn't anything solid to go on but hopefully that will change soon.

Situational but yes I do use them quite often. Not in group content though because of all the effect spam.. getting your desired effect when the field you want is covered in fields you don't is a royal pain in the donkey.

> @"Sajuuk Khar.1509" said: > > @"Teratus.2859" said: > > Not to us players, but the the people of Tyria. > I know, I was speaking about the people of Tyria. There has been nothing to suggest the common person in Tyria would have any reason to blame us for this, and with it coming out what Jormag has done in the far north(manipulating Bangar, the attacks on Jora's Keep, and Still Water Speaking), as well as his upcoming attacks on Lake Doric, and Snowden Drifts, there is even LESS reason for the common person to Tyria to feel that way. Especially with the whole theme of Champions being us getting the last even remotely major factions of Tyria together to help fight against Jormag and Primordus's forces. > That's the thing though, Bangar knew what he was doing.. he knew he was being manipulated and didn't care because he wanted the power Jormag was offering and he wanted to have his own Elder Dragon to defend his people against us.. and he constantly used us having an Elder Dragon as a call to arms for his Dominion. He just wasn't expecting Jormag to screw him over in the end in favour of a more devoted servant, much to our amusement as players :D So we've quite literally already seen this "people turning on us" thing happen among the Charr because of people like Bangar being under Jormag's influence. We've also seen the Asura in all their intelligence consider working with Jormag and the Frost legion because "Primordus is the bigger threat" And Human's.. well a good bunch of them decided to revive the White Mantle.. another bunch decided to follow Balthazar on a suicidal end of the world mission. I have no doubts what so ever that a human faction of Jormag followers would be extremely likely if Jormag was able to spread it's influence that far south.. which is what I suspect it is trying to do in the upcoming release. Jormag need only broadcast to Divinity's Reach it's messages of peace, protection and friendship and you'd see a bunch of foolish humans buy it, i'd put good money on that lol The Norn are the ones most likely to resist Jormag due to their history but many of them still fell in with the Son's, that's just how effective Jormag is at manipulating mortals.. and much as we saw in Champions Norn aka Braham's warnings fell on deaf ears with the Asura who are far far smarter than Humans and Norn. > >I do not want Primordus to be killed off this quickly, that much i've said a number of times now and I will be very disappointed if Anet take that road. > I would find it odd as well given that he isn't even awake yet. He is only waking up as per Chapter 1 Truce. > Many are predicting it.. and there's reason to suspect it may happen but god I hope it doesn't. Zhaitan got a campaign. Mordremoth got a season and an expansion. Kralkatorrik got a cameo in an expansion then a season with some of the most epic Elder Dragon moments in the game so far. Primordus has had nothing but a cameo in GW1 and a Cameo in season 3 and a few DRM's.. having him wake up and die within a few episodes would be a complete insult to what many fans believe is the biggest and baddest of all the Elder Dragons. > >That said while i'd accept it I don't want to see Jormag wiped out this quickly either > I don't think its been quickly for Jormag. Jormag has been manipulating events since Bound by Blood came out. By the time we reach the end of IBS it will be 18 months of Jormag plot. A year and a half, especially in MMO time, is forever. And we have pretty much already exploited all the big Jormag lore beats. Tooth prophecy, lost spirits, battle with Asgeir, Drakkar, etc. etc. > Yeah, hence why i'd accept it though i'd still rather Jormag stick around a little longer and have a few more awesome moments :) > > What I am not certain on though is how we get from where we are in the story currently to fighting a completely different dragon in a foreign country miles to the south.. > Easy, with Jormag, and possibly Primordus, dead, the Deep Sea Dragon is the last of the original, evil, Elder Dragons left. Why wouldn't we take the initiative, and the momentum we have built up since forming the Pact back in core, to go off and kill the last Elder Dragon so we can end what has been nearly a decade of battle for this specific objective? There is no reason for us to not go there. > Because we don't know where it is and it hasn't been making a problem of itself outside of some minor incidents. Plus there's still the whole Killing Dragons dooms the world problem that has still not been addressed yet. There's a lot of blanks to fill in there to get us from A to B. > Not to mention we have largely wrapped up all the major threats, and story beats, in Tyria and Elona > * Kryta's war with the Centaurs? Done. Seraph pushed them back into their lands, and killed their war leader. Not quite done yet.. but they are demoralised and far less active now. > * The Bandit/White Mantle infiltration? Done. The bandit leaders are dead, and the Mantle has collapsed. > * The mystery behind the Sylvari's origins, and immunity to dragon corruption? Done. Covered in HoT. These two stories are done yes. > * The Pale Tree being injured? Done. Reforging Caladbolg put her back on the path to recovery. She hasn't fully recovered yet though, we've not seen the Pale Tree in a long time. > * The Nightmare Court? Largely done. There will be holdouts of any group like that, but the losses they took in core, LWS1, and HoT, would have pushed thier already few numbers into the tank. It's unknown how many losses they took, a lot of Nightmare Court resisted Mordremoth as well. Their biggest loss however was loosing Faolin which left them leaderless.. although a group like this you would expect to recover over time so while they are not a major threat now they could be again in the future. > * Bangar being an idiot? Done. Charr civil war plot is ended. Sorta.. Bangar is a slave but his Dominion army is still active.. and under Jormag's control. So sure, the civil war is over but Jormag's invasion is yet to come. > * The Flame Legion being evil? Done. Original leadership killed, and remnants brought back into Charr civilization with Efram at the head. Largely yes.. I expect there are still hold outs for the old ways though, i'm still not entirely sold on the idea of Flame Legion being the "good guys" now lol I expect a bunch fell in with Bangar which severely crippled them but a small handful of diehards went underground much like the Mantle did in Gw1 to regroup over time, I doubt we've seen the last of the bad Flame Legion yet, but we probably won't see them again for a long time either.. unless i'm right not to trust the ones claiming to be good now lol > * Branded problems in Charr lands? Done. Kralkatorrik is dead, Aurene is purifying the Brand, and the Charr are using thumper machines to force the last of the branded out from underground so they can be killed. In Charr lands.. the brand stretches far and if I recall right the branded were often migrating southward to be closer to their master so I expect they will be lingering around in the more remote areas of the desert for a while, I don't think they've all been destroyed yet nor will be for a long time. Specially since we learned Kralkatorrik learned how to revive them in his last year of life. There's also the damage Kralk did in the mists, we've yet to see the major effects of that. > * Charr/Human conflicts? Done. the treaty has been signed, and the major funders of both the Renegades, and the Separatists, have been killed. Yep this one is done, at best a few remnants left on the human side.. as we saw early in IBS Renegades were joining up with Bangar so these factions did still exist over the years. > * Anything to do with the Norn? The Tooth Prophecy? The lost Spirits of the Wild? Asgeir's battle with Jormag? Drakkar/Jhavi getting revenge? Pretty much done, or in the process. > * Elona issues? Forged have been mopped up. Joko is dead, and his empire collapsed. Sunspears have been restored. There is a new coalition government helping rebuild the region. > These are largely done too I agree. > Once IBS ends, the only systemic issues left in Tyria/Elona are the ghost problem in Ascalon, and the Inquest being up to no good. There really just isn't much left for us to do in Tyria right now. Even if there is no big story hook into it, there is no reason for us to not immediately go "lets go to Cantha and kill Bubbles to end this" to ride the momentum and finish the job we started back in core. > > I think needing a big story reason, like Jormag manipulating everyone into forcing us out, is over thinking a simple issue. But we don't know where the sea dragon is, it's not causing mainland Tyria any problems and hasn't been for a very long time. That need to go to Cantha is one of those missing pieces, we don't even know the sea dragon is there or anywhere near Cantha. Just having our characters say "lets see what Cantha is upto" would be a really poor way to take us there lol As I said too, we still don't have a solution for killing Elder Dragons yet without replacements and that could be a reason we do end up doing to Cantha to seek out Kuunavang but atm there appears to be nothing suggesting that will end up happening.. and if that's how we do end up solving the problem then it still leaves 2 dragons needing replacements. There is always the dreaded Aurine can replace them all option too but that would be such a cop out excuse in my and a lot of peoples opinions.. we really don't want to end up with another "hey we found mordremoths weakness at the last minute through sheer coincidence" moment lol

Adding new playable races at this point is practically impossible. The Commander is too integral to the progressing story line specially now that they are essentially a Dragon's Champion due to a bond that was build up over literal years!! of in game story content. It would be a broken mess and a continuity problem with utterly no benefits what so ever to just start a new race so late into the story since your characters race means NOTHING! in this game from a gameplay perspective. Not to mention the whole "Oh that commander we followed for years and built a friendship with is just gone and this random nobody Tengu/Kodan etc is totally our new leader now.. cause reasons".. I mean people already criticise the writing in this game but holy hell would this one be the epitome of horrendous and broken writing lol It's just far too late for new races now... or far too early.. The only way I can see new races being added to this game without completely screwing up the game's continuity and demanding a massive workload in the process is to do it AFTER! this Elder Dragon storyline officially ends and we move on to entirely new and separate story's that have nothing to do with the current story that Gw2 has been telling for the last several years. Adding playable Tengu, Kodan and other races that start in these new campaigns and that cannot play the older story missions.. that would be perfectly fine but I highly doubt Anet would do that due to the restrictions they would require and having to deal with the annoyance of fans saying "why can't I play HoT story as my Tengu etc" I get the appeal though, I'd love to play as a Tengu myself but there's no way they could make a Tengu "commander" and do it justice at this point.. especially since the very lore of the game forbids such a thing from happening. Either they add them in for a second main campaign in the future canonically after the Dragon Story ends or never add new races at all.. and honestly I think the latter is the far far more likely outcome there. You'd have a better chance asking for new classes.. which is another thing that is extremely unlikely to happen due to the sheer workload required and the problems it would cause.

Looking forward to seeing a Brown Bear with bird animations XD