Jaunty.6018 Posted August 19, 2018 Author Share Posted August 19, 2018 I'm admittedly very surprised to see how many people actually _like_ to farm. Me personally, farming (particularly in MMOS) burns me out fast and I often stop playing the game (and sometimes all games) entirely to reassess my life. Makes me feel like a rat in a maze. It's different if I can do something else while farming though, like watch something on Netflix. But with Istan, your eyes need to be on the screen at all times--or perhaps I'm just not good enough to be able to do that yet. Netflix & Istan = GW2 end game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithranArkanere.8957 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 $20 may seem like little to you, it's a lot for many people. That's why the only fair pricing of digital goods is pricing that goes down over the years, like many Steam games: Release at full price like $60, then over the years go down to $30, then have occasional sales 50, 75, 80 and eventually 90 off, so people can buy the game for $3. This way the company gets the most profit as possible, since everyone pays when they can afford to pay, and instead not getting any more sales once everyone who can afford the game at a higher price has bought it, they keep getting more sales until everyone who wants to buy the game can get it. 10000 times 2 is more than 100 times 100. This way everyone gets to play the games. Win/win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehenna.3625 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 People mainly have two resources to spend: money and time. And yes, they both are resources. I am like you where I prefer to spend a little money (in my view at least) so I have to spend less time on farming. I do farm but for mats mostly. And I know that indeed 20 bucks can be a lot of money for people. It used to be for me as well. I'm luckier today in that but it wasn't always like that. So when people have more time than money to spend, then farming gold makes complete sense. I'd say it's harder for people with little money and little time but the easy farms like Istan help there. All in all I think ArenaNet have struck a fair balance in that, though I do agree that some farms are OP compared to others which is a shame, but that's also another topic ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cragga the Eighty Third.60 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > I ran Istan for about 3 hours and got no more than 30 gold. I'm aware some people can make more, but it's still not much. Considering you can spend $20 on various sites and get 2,000 gems, which equate to around 600 gold, I see gold farming in this game as nothing more than pointless slave labor. Even if you have a low wage job why not just work 2-3 extra hours and get a gem card? > > At the rate I've experienced, it would take you _60 hours of farming_ to get 600 gold. 60 in-game hours vs. 2-3 hours of real work (or less if you're fortunate). It makes no sense. It's not as if gold farming is _super fun_ or anything. Hell, you can't even watch Netflix while you do it because the gameplay is too intense. I find it hard to believe nobody has brought up the exchange rates (unless I missed it) but, no, you do NOT get 600 gold for $20. (Or 2000 gems, for that matter.) You get 1600 gems for $20, and at the current exchange, that's worth a measly 360 gold. Still sound like a good deal to you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwilightSoul.9048 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 I play the game for the sake of playing the game, why would I play a game if I'd just fullfill all my goals by paying for them? I don't get people who buy a game and toss money at the game until they have everything they wanted. I mean what do they play the game for after that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Astralporing.1957 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > @"Lambent.6375" said: > > Some of us want to earn our gold from playing the game. > > > > If we just bought everything, that wouldn't leave us with much to do. (Speaking of open world pve players) > > I guess that points out a pretty big flaw in Guild Wars 2 then, eh? The fact that you can buy so much of the cool stuff with real money. It's not the fault with the game. It's the fault with the "card swiping for everything" attitude. Seriously, if you'd rather skip playing the game, why do you play the game at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obtena.7952 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > @"stephaniehall.2631" said: > > I sort of feel the exact opposite, why on earth would you pay for something you can get for free just by playing, when the whole point of a game is to play it.... even if I did have £20 to spare I would definitely use that to take my kid's for an ice cream. Don't get me wrong sometimes I wish I could get things faster but that's also my motivation to keep playing, if I already have everything by swiping and there's no challenge to the game... I don't know what would motivate me to continue playing. > > Well the point of the game is to enjoy it. If you're spending hours per day grinding for gold that could be so much more easily obtained by throwing a few bucks at the game, then I don't see that as very enjoyable personally. I feel I'm wasting my life when I grind needlessly. If there weren't an omnipresent cash shop in the game I wouldn't mind it as much. The farming would then be the most efficient way to get what I want from the game. But that's not the case. That seems to be your sticking point ... the people that play to earn gold don't look at it like a grind. I guess that's a matter of perspective but if you were a player that played some MMO's from 15 years ago, then THIS game is relatively tame in terms of 'grind'. I wouldn't classify anything in this game a grind actually. I don't actually get the question; it seems pretty obvious why people would 'grind' (or what I would call 'play') the game the way they want. It's part of the greatness of the game; lots of choice to do things how you want to do them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Dimension.9014 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 At least farming gold accomplish something. You know what is a total waste of time? Playing MOBA games like dota and LoL. You accomplish nothing in those games but frustration. Here in GW2, players at least can farm gold to achieve something. For some people, buying them with real money remove that accomplishment while some do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blude.6812 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > @"Khisanth.2948" said: > > > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > > > > I ran Istan for about 3 hours and got no more than 30 gold. I'm aware some people can make more, but it's still not much. Considering you can spend $20 on various sites and get 2,000 gems, which equate to around 600 gold, I see gold farming in this game as nothing more than pointless slave labor. Even if you have a low wage job why not just work 2-3 extra hours and get a gem card? > > > > > > > > > > At the rate I've experienced, it would take you _60 hours of farming_ to get 600 gold. 60 in-game hours vs. 2-3 hours of real work (or less if you're fortunate). It makes no sense. It's not as if gold farming is _super fun_ or anything. Hell, you can't even watch Netflix while you do it because the gameplay is too intense. > > > > > > > > First off, not every one decides to risk their account with illegal sites, especially when there is in-game legal methods of converting gems to gold. > > > > > > Ebay and Amazon are illegal? That's news to me. > > > > > > > They are if the sellers obtained the cards via fraud. > > > Okay so assuming ALL sellers on eBay and Amazon are fraudulent (which they certainly are not), you could still get the 2,000 gem card from retail stores for $25. Not a big difference and my point still stands. > There are no retail stores in in my area that sell cards, period. In fact they are getting hard to find in many many areas, actually no where in Canada. Amazon.ca doesn't carry them at all except 3rd party private vendors at incredibly inflated prices. Ditto for ebay - inflated prices. Besides selling for way over suggested retail, it is a know risk. Gem cards are not an option for many many players. BTW cards are 25$ US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstealer.5978 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"MithranArkanere.8957" said: > $20 may seem like little to you, it's a lot for many people. That's why the only fair pricing of digital goods is pricing that goes down over the years, like many Steam games: Release at full price like $60, then over the years go down to $30, then have occasional sales 50, 75, 80 and eventually 90 off, so people can buy the game for $3. > > This way the company gets the most profit as possible, since everyone pays when they can afford to pay, and instead not getting any more sales once everyone who can afford the game at a higher price has bought it, they keep getting more sales until everyone who wants to buy the game can get it. 10000 times 2 is more than 100 times 100. > > This way everyone gets to play the games. Win/win. Your missing the point by a mile. Sure if they sell 10k at $2 a piece that's 20k in sales but how much do the company actually make in profit once all expenses are covered.. lets say they make 50% profit on that 20k sales.. so 10k profits. Sounds great right, until you think how much they can then make when they sell 100 at $100. You forget ANET are not in this for charity they have to turn a profit, a sufficient profit in order to keep everything going, everyone employed and the lights switched on. Selling a product for the sake of selling it is not always the soundest business strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyWolf.8670 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > @"Lambent.6375" said: > > Some of us want to earn our gold from playing the game. > > > > If we just bought everything, that wouldn't leave us with much to do. (Speaking of open world pve players) > > I guess that points out a pretty big flaw in Guild Wars 2 then, eh? The fact that you can buy so much of the cool stuff with real money. I personally wish the cash shop wasn't there at all, but since it IS there, it's always an option--and often the more logical one. It's the biggest flaw. And since you can exchange gold for gems the gold drop rate is pathetic to encourage you to buy it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sokeenoppa.5384 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 Some ppl have more money, some have more time ^^ When i have long overtime work months ill Make more money, but i have less Time to play, at those months i buy gems for gold. Its like reward for me or something like that. When i have more time and less money, i like to farm some gold. Also question :D is there Even many players who care about ingame gold? I mean after full Gear set you can basically just play, no need to farm anything. Im full geared my 2 mains with right Gear and right Look, where should i spend My gold? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AliamRationem.5172 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 You're oversimplifying. Players are motivated by many things. Rewards (i.e. gold) are only one thing that motivates players. I expect many players who can stomach farming the same events for hours are motivated not strictly by the rewards, but are also motivated by efficiency. They see it as a personal challenge, not unlike improving your time in a race or downing a boss a few seconds faster. When they earn more gold per time spent, they find that rewarding in itself. It's not always just about the gold. For players like myself, farming gold is not appealing at all. But I will pop in and run the Istan event cycle now and then because it is rewarding and I enjoy the events. I just don't enjoy doing those events over and over again for hours because maximizing gold rewards for my time spent is just not something that interests me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malediktus.9250 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 Yes, farming gold in this game is slave labor and a waste of time. Never visited istan meta again after finishing the achievements because it is so boring Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edgy McEdgelord.4790 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 If you need to swipe to get gold in the most casual and easy game ever you may as well just be a bad player. My 2 cents (or rather silver). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndigoSundown.5419 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > If you're spending hours per day grinding for gold that could be so much more easily obtained by throwing a few bucks at the game, then I don't see that as very enjoyable personally. I feel I'm wasting my life when I grind needlessly. Grind is the nature of the MMO genre. Sure, it's possible to play MMO's without grinding. However, it's not possible to play them and get most of what they offer as rewards without cyclical repetition, whatever the time cycle on that repetition is. MMO's _are_ about wasting our time. If you're more concerned about doing what you find fun, do that -- and don't worry about virtual "rewards." > If there weren't an omnipresent cash shop in the game I wouldn't mind it as much. The farming would then be the most efficient way to get what I want from the game. But that's not the case. I play GW2 sparingly. I rarely even think about either the gem store, or the currency exchange. To me, an "omnipresent" cash shop is more like what I saw in one Freemium game. Every inconvenience the game threw at me came with a reminder that I could bypass said inconvenience with a shop purchase or the "optional" sub. Perhaps what makes the GW2 exchange omnipresent for you is that you place more emphasis on getting virtual stuff than I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blocki.4931 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 This thread reads like "lol why don't all these people work irl and just credit card farm xD do you like being poor?" The reason is that if you just buy every shiny right away you have no reason to actually play the game, get bored and quit in a few months Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gehenna.3625 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > I ran Istan for about 3 hours and got no more than 30 gold. I'm aware some people can make more, but it's still not much. Considering you can spend $20 on various sites and get 2,000 gems, which equate to around 600 gold, I see gold farming in this game as nothing more than pointless slave labor. Even if you have a low wage job why not just work 2-3 extra hours and get a gem card? > > > > At the rate I've experienced, it would take you _60 hours of farming_ to get 600 gold. 60 in-game hours vs. 2-3 hours of real work (or less if you're fortunate). It makes no sense. It's not as if gold farming is _super fun_ or anything. Hell, you can't even watch Netflix while you do it because the gameplay is too intense. > > First off, not every one decides to risk their account with illegal sites, especially when there is in-game legal methods of converting gems to gold. > Who said anything about illegal? Different sites have different prices but even amazon sells em. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sorudo.9054 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 i hate farming for anything, Anet just loves to overprice literally everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Algreg.3629 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 Considering the exchange rate, I guess I earn way more gold in real life per hour than farming would ever give me, but swiping the card for in-game items would absolutely tarnish every accomplishment for me. Guess I am pretty oldschool. I am not a big farmer though, I just hop into such events when I don`t feel like playing at my peak. I want real life and gaming to be as clearly divided as possible. Also, I do not care about "fashion wars" and only go after "meaningful" items, in fact, all the gemstore fluff with sparkling wings and stuff is pretty offputting for me, I prefer the down to earth look of the original skins, most of which can be earned in game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khisanth.2948 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Bloodstealer.5978" said: > > @"Khisanth.2948" said: > > > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > > > > I ran Istan for about 3 hours and got no more than 30 gold. I'm aware some people can make more, but it's still not much. Considering you can spend $20 on various sites and get 2,000 gems, which equate to around 600 gold, I see gold farming in this game as nothing more than pointless slave labor. Even if you have a low wage job why not just work 2-3 extra hours and get a gem card? > > > > > > > > > > At the rate I've experienced, it would take you _60 hours of farming_ to get 600 gold. 60 in-game hours vs. 2-3 hours of real work (or less if you're fortunate). It makes no sense. It's not as if gold farming is _super fun_ or anything. Hell, you can't even watch Netflix while you do it because the gameplay is too intense. > > > > > > > > First off, not every one decides to risk their account with illegal sites, especially when there is in-game legal methods of converting gems to gold. > > > > > > Ebay and Amazon are illegal? That's news to me. > > > > > > > They are if the sellers obtained the cards via fraud. > > > > Does not make a site illegal just because someone sells something on them that is not legit.. Would be interesting to see how you would handle a legal challenge from those sites though. > There are many sites/shops that sell gem cards... without issue, some ANET partner with some they don't. Does not make any of them illegal. > If your choosing to use goldsellers to procure gold, then that is entirely different and yeah you stand to risk your account, but gem cards not so much unless they were in fact stolen cards, which I would hazard a guess is a lot less frequent than being scammed by a goldseller. > Pretty sure even if you purchased a stolen card, then the worst that could happen is the card code gets refused when trying to activate it in the cashop, your account would not be at risk because your not giving such details to either the site or the seller, your just left out of pocket. The actual sequence of events would be 1) thief buys cards using stolen credit card 2) thief sells card to you 3) you use the card 4) real owner realize the theft occurred and contact their CC company and initiate a charge back for purchases they didn't make 5) that charge back is now associated with your account and you get all the consequences of associated with a chargeback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
otto.5684 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > I ran Istan for about 3 hours and got no more than 30 gold. I'm aware some people can make more, but it's still not much. Considering you can spend $20 on various sites and get 2,000 gems, which equate to around 600 gold, I see gold farming in this game as nothing more than pointless slave labor. Even if you have a low wage job why not just work 2-3 extra hours and get a gem card? > > At the rate I've experienced, it would take you _60 hours of farming_ to get 600 gold. 60 in-game hours vs. 2-3 hours of real work (or less if you're fortunate). It makes no sense. It's not as if gold farming is _super fun_ or anything. Hell, you can't even watch Netflix while you do it because the gameplay is too intense. I play the game to have fun. Making gold is just a bonus. I do not play the game to get in game currency. If playing the game is not fun for you, I am not sure why do you play it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodstealer.5978 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Khisanth.2948" said: > > @"Bloodstealer.5978" said: > > > @"Khisanth.2948" said: > > > > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > > > > @"Cyninja.2954" said: > > > > > > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > > > > > > I ran Istan for about 3 hours and got no more than 30 gold. I'm aware some people can make more, but it's still not much. Considering you can spend $20 on various sites and get 2,000 gems, which equate to around 600 gold, I see gold farming in this game as nothing more than pointless slave labor. Even if you have a low wage job why not just work 2-3 extra hours and get a gem card? > > > > > > > > > > > > At the rate I've experienced, it would take you _60 hours of farming_ to get 600 gold. 60 in-game hours vs. 2-3 hours of real work (or less if you're fortunate). It makes no sense. It's not as if gold farming is _super fun_ or anything. Hell, you can't even watch Netflix while you do it because the gameplay is too intense. > > > > > > > > > > First off, not every one decides to risk their account with illegal sites, especially when there is in-game legal methods of converting gems to gold. > > > > > > > > Ebay and Amazon are illegal? That's news to me. > > > > > > > > > > They are if the sellers obtained the cards via fraud. > > > > > > > Does not make a site illegal just because someone sells something on them that is not legit.. Would be interesting to see how you would handle a legal challenge from those sites though. > > There are many sites/shops that sell gem cards... without issue, some ANET partner with some they don't. Does not make any of them illegal. > > If your choosing to use goldsellers to procure gold, then that is entirely different and yeah you stand to risk your account, but gem cards not so much unless they were in fact stolen cards, which I would hazard a guess is a lot less frequent than being scammed by a goldseller. > > Pretty sure even if you purchased a stolen card, then the worst that could happen is the card code gets refused when trying to activate it in the cashop, your account would not be at risk because your not giving such details to either the site or the seller, your just left out of pocket. > > The actual sequence of events would be > > 1) thief buys cards using stolen credit card > 2) thief sells card to you > 3) you use the card > 4) real owner realize the theft occurred and contact their CC company and initiate a charge back for purchases they didn't make > 5) that charge back is now associated with your account and you get all the consequences of associated with a chargeback Wrong.. The charge back on their card is nothing to do with me as I buy the card through the website with my own cc.. therefore account has nothing to do with it.. The sites are merely a marketplace with a purchase portal that will take my CC details not the stolen card details. At worst the card code will be refused on use and I would be left out of pocket as ANET will have no grounds to reimburse, otherwise ANET might want proof of purchase.. which you will always get when purchasing through such sites. If they were illegal, ANET would never offer out gem cards in the first place. If I buy the cards directly from the thief for cash then maybe there could be grounds for ANET to action my account, as there would likely be no proof of purchase. But, like I said, if you brave enough to raise a legal challenge to the likes of Amazon, eBay or such then go for it, but let me grab some popcorn first so I can enjoy the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daishi.6027 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Jaunty.6018" said: > I ran Istan for about 3 hours and got no more than 30 gold. I'm aware some people can make more, but it's still not much. Considering you can spend $20 on various sites and get 2,000 gems, which equate to around 600 gold, I see gold farming in this game as nothing more than pointless slave labor. Even if you have a low wage job why not just work 2-3 extra hours and get a gem card? > > At the rate I've experienced, it would take you _60 hours of farming_ to get 600 gold. 60 in-game hours vs. 2-3 hours of real work (or less if you're fortunate). It makes no sense. It's not as if gold farming is _super fun_ or anything. Hell, you can't even watch Netflix while you do it because the gameplay is too intense. Yes, this is the core business model. As to why? Well some people don't have as much disposable income, as they do free time. Could be a bit more balanced though, feel like warframe for example gives you better numbers for both framing + trading in the free market, vs buying directly. Also I'd like location based prices, Paying an arm and a leg cuz I'm in Canada isn't fun. Personally I find farming boring, I like to kill players be it in sPvP, WvW, Guild hall, or Mist Arena.... Most of these options don't pay well, but they keep me from being bored. (wtb gold farm in mist arena plz) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreyWolf.8670 Posted August 19, 2018 Share Posted August 19, 2018 > @"Edgy McEdgelord.4790" said: > If you need to swipe to get gold in the most casual and easy game ever you may as well just be a bad player. My 2 cents (or rather silver). Or maybe you don't want to do the same thing over and over for it? That's boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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