This is the death of this game's pvp / wvw

[Razor.6392]

This is what happens when you put a bunch of people who at best handled excel documents in the office in charge of balance.

 

This part killed me btw:

 

"We want cooldowns to feel meaningful"

 

Quick scroll down shows that Holo Leap still has a 2 seconds cooldown.

 

 

[Shao.7236]

"Holo Leap: Reduced power coefficient from 1.25 to 0.91"

 

Have you know the devs who play this game are not golds either.

 

Patch hasn't even dropped yet and we already getting doomsday calls.

[ZeteCommander.4937]

Holo still has extreme mobility

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

I'm willing to hold the doomsday calls until the patch goes live and I firsthand get to experience what it feels like

As long as they are willing to make adjustments promptly after the initial launch, throwing a fit because you lost access to a skill that pitched you high damage with CC or invuln is probably jumping the gun.

 

Rampage survived this, pretty sure everything else will. if it doesnt, the balance team is likely going to have an ear to the ground to tune up whatever is the most useless.

 

And for the people saying "bunker meta weh", healing got toned down too. Now interrupting key skills ideally will make your opponent crash and burn. and if you dont use your skills properly, your opponent lives.

 

This ain't bunker meta. Bunker meta was lower damage, high healing.

[Tycura.1982]

I'm excited. Some of the changes are questionable but it's a good place to start.

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

> @"Shao.7236" said:

> Have you know the devs who play this game are not golds either.

 

^ It's true. The person largely responsible for this patch has a lot of experience actually PvPing.

 

Whether that's a good or bad thing is up to you really.

 

 

[Jski.6180]

I think its bad that anet is trying to use dmg to balance the game with out looking into the cc effects them self and the counter play of such cc for all classes. Its even worst when you realize they seem not be going after classes build in hp / def. It feels like this was not worked on as a group more of just ppl off doing there own thing. I get the feeling there no leadership at anet any more.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said:

> > @"Shao.7236" said:

> > Have you know the devs who play this game are not golds either.

>

> ^ It's true. The person largely responsible for this patch has a lot of experience actually PvPing.

>

> Whether that's a good or bad thing is up to you really.

>

>

 

They also are, apparently, an ele main.

Go figure.

[Ysmir.4986]

Considering how much the game will change, trying to anticipate the effects of the balance patch on the game mode and on the meta is frankly...

 

... idiotic.

[Burnfall.9573]

> @"Ysmir.4986" said:

> Considering how much the game will change, trying to anticipate the effects of the balance patch on the game mode and on the meta is frankly...

>

> ... idiotic.

 

what's 'idiotic' is that they are not attacking the root cause. by removing its entirely or redesigning it in a healthy way. Instead what they are doing is shuffling big numbers around and reducing its effects.

 

-The majority of us have been here before, have seen this all before; instead of dealing with the cause, dealing with its effects is far more important-

[Apocaly.2786]

> @"Ysmir.4986" said:

> Considering how much the game will change, trying to anticipate the effects of the balance patch on the game mode and on the meta is frankly...

>

> ... idiotic.

 

I aggggggggrreeeeee. Nothing else to say. :)

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

> @"Ysmir.4986" said:

> Considering how much the game will change, trying to anticipate the effects of the balance patch on the game mode and on the meta is frankly...

>

> ... idiotic.

 

No it's not. How do you play this game for 8 years and not gain a very solid grasp on it will effect intra-class combat dynamic when something is added or removed? These kinds of comments I'm seeing are pretty cop-out imo. Look, MOST of these patches notes look promising to me, but some of that stuff is just.... I mean don't understand what they're thinking. The "all hard CCs deal 0 damage" thing, if anything is going to ruin the game's pvp/wvw like @"Razor.6392" said, that'll be it. That single change is going to throw things into such a wonky state, and cause so many problems, I haven't time to discuss it right now. Maybe a bit later.

[Ysmir.4986]

> @"Trevor Boyer.6524" said:

> > @"Ysmir.4986" said:

> > Considering how much the game will change, trying to anticipate the effects of the balance patch on the game mode and on the meta is frankly...

> >

> > ... idiotic.

>

> No it's not. How do you play this game for 8 years and not gain a very solid grasp on it will effect intra-class combat dynamic when something is added or removed?

 

- Because we never had a patch on a scale where almost every single skill in the game is affected,

- Hence, we have no feel for what the game will be when it comes out,

- Changes only make sense in synergy with other changes - what is meta is decided by what else is viable at the moment, which can only be determined through testing and trial and error,

- Hence, people are talking based on their expectations centered around their class and speculating on something they never even experienced. Which is next door to worthless.

 

The CC thing is based on the philosophy that either a skill does damage or hard CC, which in my opinion, is healthier for the game. Rampage is a great trial run for that philosophy and worked marvelously. Reduced the bullshit "one click insta win" effect and yet kept its relevant status as an elite skill.

 

So frankly, I think you are in the hard minority here, concerning CC doing no damage.

[PLS.4095]

> @"Razor.6392" said:

> This is what happens when you put a bunch of people who at best handled excel documents in the office in charge of balance.

>

> This part killed me btw:

>

> "We want cooldowns to feel meaningful"

>

> Quick scroll down shows that Holo Leap still has a 2 seconds cooldown.

>

>

 

The only one dead here is you.

[Burnfall.9573]

> @"PLS.4095" said:

> > @"Razor.6392" said:

> > This is what happens when you put a bunch of people who at best handled excel documents in the office in charge of balance.

> >

> > This part killed me btw:

> >

> > "We want cooldowns to feel meaningful"

> >

> > Quick scroll down shows that Holo Leap still has a 2 seconds cooldown.

> >

> >

>

> The only one dead here is you.

 

That was cruel and was not needed. be Respectful!!

[LolLookAtMyAP.8394]

Yeah I'm totally fine having hard CCs not do damage. I don't see why they should.

[Dantheman.3589]

It’s a death but hopefully a rebirth for anyone that enjoys the next meta

[JTGuevara.9018]

Bwaahahahaha!! It will the death of something! It will be the death of players getting carried by their oh-snap buttons and buffed damage and healing output! **Bring on this new era.**

[MyPuppy.8970]

> @"LolLookAtMyAP.8394" said:

> Yeah I'm totally fine having hard CCs not do damage. I don't see why they should.

 

Yup, hard CC should be used as a mean, not an end. Creating window of opportunities. That's it. Although they should be further balanced around their effect, duration, cd, etc.

[Multicolorhipster.9751]

> @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:

> They also are, apparently, an ele main.

> Go figure.

 

Yeah, I mean; if it were me i'd just buff Warrior to be insanely powerful because balancing from an objective standpoint is pretty hard when you play, and you're actually invested.

 

I'd also probably nerf whatever class I don't like most into the dirt like mira- Oh. ?

[Aeolus.3615]

> @"Multicolorhipster.9751" said:

> > @"Azure The Heartless.3261" said:

> > They also are, apparently, an ele main.

> > Go figure.

>

> Yeah, I mean; if it were me i'd just buff Warrior to be insanely powerful because balancing from an objective standpoint is pretty hard when you play, and you're actually invested.

>

> I'd also probably nerf whatever class I don't like most into the dirt like mira- Oh. ?

 

Give time guys, OFC some values will go up and others down, it will just be a long process, this is some sorta skill reset due we never had a trully balance in this game nor good/real iteration when creating classes.

[Bast.7253]

Every skill is changing but the meta and build preferences really aren't. At least not yet. I imagine condi will still be pretty strong, because power damage will go down considerably and sustained damage will be more preferable.

 

I really don't think it's going to change that much though. It's really just a flat damage nerf for everything across the board, at least power-based. The builds that are strong now will stay strong, they'll just take twice as long to dominate.

 

Also, holo regen is only getting a 10hp nerf? lol. Okay. Not really seeing anything about the holo nerfs that will make it any less ridiculous.

[Shao.7236]

> @"cptaylor.2670" said:

> I imagine condi will still be pretty strong, because power damage will go down considerably and sustained damage will be more preferable.

 

No, Expertise/Concentration is long gone from PvP and conditions have seen duration decreases or entire removals. Even if those stats are available in WvW that makes conditions strong, so are the ones that makes power strong as well.

[LolLookAtMyAP.8394]

> @"cptaylor.2670" said:

> Every skill is changing but the meta and build preferences really aren't. At least not yet. I imagine condi will still be pretty strong, because power damage will go down considerably and sustained damage will be more preferable.

>

> I really don't think it's going to change that much though. It's really just a flat damage nerf for everything across the board, at least power-based. The builds that are strong now will stay strong, they'll just take twice as long to dominate.

>

> Also, holo regen is only getting a 10hp nerf? lol. Okay. Not really seeing anything about the holo nerfs that will make it any less ridiculous.

 

Corona burst doesn't give any more stability. Prime Light Beam and Shockwave coefficient dropped down to 0.01. Healing Turret CD increased to 30 seconds.

[otto.5684]

> @"Shao.7236" said:

> "Holo Leap: Reduced power coefficient from 1.25 to 0.91"

>

> Have you know the devs who play this game are not golds either.

>

> Patch hasn't even dropped yet and we already getting doomsday calls.

 

It does not really need to. The direction is wrong. This is rebooting of the entire sPvP from scratch. It may or may not work. I like the current sPvP. It has issues but the system worked for years. I have no interest and playing the equivalent of a new sPvP mode.

 

Could it be better someday? Maybe. It is sure as shit ain’t going to be remotely balanced based on the current suggested changes. It is going to take months, maybe even year to be balanced, based on Anet rate.

 

And I might be welling to play along if there are new elites or weapons. But there is not. It is a derivative of the current system and the existing build. I have zero interest In that. This an old game. I play it cuz I like the stuff it has. Taking it away for something that may or may not work, while not adding anything brand new, is not going to cut it.