Anyone Hoping For A Support Warrior Spec?

[Opopanax.1803]

> @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > > @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > > I think y'all underestimate how good heal warrior is right now. it's the meta healer in spvp right now with tempest, and it was just nerfed last patch. it's a better support than any guardian, druid or rev centaur build right now, even after big nerfs.

> > >

> > > warrior is also meta on minstrel shout heals for boon strip and support in WvW too.

> > >

> > > adding more support to this class is just going to make it overkill, and either the spec or tactics will have to be gutted for the sake of balance, as support warrior right now is already so strong it's basically the only way to play the class in PvP modes. as for PvE, everyone already knows about banners no need to go over them.

> > >

> > > a mobility utility spec with pistols would be far better. you know something that might let warrior play damage on side node in PvP again. a support spec that would be so broken it would have to be nerfed on launch or break the game is really NOT what we need.

> >

> > You folks keep calling warrior with banner in pve "Support". This is not accurate. It is a dps spec that slots group buff utilities.

> >

> > In no way is a banner slave a support in any sense of a minstrel or harrier firebrand, renegade, druid, or tempest in pve.

> >

> > You don't play them or gear them like support, you gear and play them like dps...because they are.

>

> feel like you completely missed the point of my WvW and sPvP focused post my dude.

>

> still, I would classify a full bar of group buff utilities as being a support. not a healer sure, but an offensive support none the less.

>

> regardless, in two of three gamemodes warrior is stuck playing heal support. power creep to this role is hardly what we need there.

 

It would be better to delete Runes of Trooper for pvp/wvw since this is a large part of why shouts are run.

 

Although a lot of your post talks about pvp/wvw, you bring up banner slaves, which I have only ever seen in raids/fractals. And as you admit, this is a dps spec that uses banners, it is not geared for +heal or +concentration.

 

If an actual heal/boon spec was made, all you need to do is make utilities necessary to compete w shouts and banners, and possibly change Trooper runes and you are good to go.

[DKRathalos.9625]

> @"Lan Deathrider.5910" said:

> Give warrior a pair of pistols, some F2-F4 skills that offer group support though boons and unstrippable buffs like I mentioned above, and then you have the workings of an actually good, effective, and FUN support build that give flexibility in the utility slots to augment that support in various ways.

I prefer something like.... put the banner on F3, then give berserker f2 something. So warrior carry 1 banner at a time instead of 2. Then give some more meaningfull utility skill rather than buff and debuff only, warrior literally got no damaging utility now for pvp/wvw purpose.

[Acyk.9671]

> @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > > @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > > > @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > > > I think y'all underestimate how good heal warrior is right now. it's the meta healer in spvp right now with tempest, and it was just nerfed last patch. it's a better support than any guardian, druid or rev centaur build right now, even after big nerfs.

> > > >

> > > > warrior is also meta on minstrel shout heals for boon strip and support in WvW too.

> > > >

> > > > adding more support to this class is just going to make it overkill, and either the spec or tactics will have to be gutted for the sake of balance, as support warrior right now is already so strong it's basically the only way to play the class in PvP modes. as for PvE, everyone already knows about banners no need to go over them.

> > > >

> > > > a mobility utility spec with pistols would be far better. you know something that might let warrior play damage on side node in PvP again. a support spec that would be so broken it would have to be nerfed on launch or break the game is really NOT what we need.

> > >

> > > You folks keep calling warrior with banner in pve "Support". This is not accurate. It is a dps spec that slots group buff utilities.

> > >

> > > In no way is a banner slave a support in any sense of a minstrel or harrier firebrand, renegade, druid, or tempest in pve.

> > >

> > > You don't play them or gear them like support, you gear and play them like dps...because they are.

> >

> > feel like you completely missed the point of my WvW and sPvP focused post my dude.

> >

> > still, I would classify a full bar of group buff utilities as being a support. not a healer sure, but an offensive support none the less.

> >

> > regardless, in two of three gamemodes warrior is stuck playing heal support. power creep to this role is hardly what we need there.

>

> It would be better to delete Runes of Trooper for pvp/wvw since this is a large part of why shouts are run.

>

> Although a lot of your post talks about pvp/wvw, you bring up banner slaves, which I have only ever seen in raids/fractals. And as you admit, this is a dps spec that uses banners, it is not geared for +heal or +concentration.

>

> If an actual heal/boon spec was made, all you need to do is make utilities necessary to compete w shouts and banners, and possibly change Trooper runes and you are good to go.

 

Why change trooper rune? it's not overpowered, it removes 1 condi.

New E spec utilities are not there to replace core utilities like shouts but to offer alternatives or complete what's missing in group support, be it in range/radius or effect. I don't see why you should reduce shouts' effectiveness for new utilities when people often play 2/3 different types of utilities anyway.

[Opopanax.1803]

> @"Acyk.9671" said:

> > @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > > @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > > > @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > > > > @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > > > > I think y'all underestimate how good heal warrior is right now. it's the meta healer in spvp right now with tempest, and it was just nerfed last patch. it's a better support than any guardian, druid or rev centaur build right now, even after big nerfs.

> > > > >

> > > > > warrior is also meta on minstrel shout heals for boon strip and support in WvW too.

> > > > >

> > > > > adding more support to this class is just going to make it overkill, and either the spec or tactics will have to be gutted for the sake of balance, as support warrior right now is already so strong it's basically the only way to play the class in PvP modes. as for PvE, everyone already knows about banners no need to go over them.

> > > > >

> > > > > a mobility utility spec with pistols would be far better. you know something that might let warrior play damage on side node in PvP again. a support spec that would be so broken it would have to be nerfed on launch or break the game is really NOT what we need.

> > > >

> > > > You folks keep calling warrior with banner in pve "Support". This is not accurate. It is a dps spec that slots group buff utilities.

> > > >

> > > > In no way is a banner slave a support in any sense of a minstrel or harrier firebrand, renegade, druid, or tempest in pve.

> > > >

> > > > You don't play them or gear them like support, you gear and play them like dps...because they are.

> > >

> > > feel like you completely missed the point of my WvW and sPvP focused post my dude.

> > >

> > > still, I would classify a full bar of group buff utilities as being a support. not a healer sure, but an offensive support none the less.

> > >

> > > regardless, in two of three gamemodes warrior is stuck playing heal support. power creep to this role is hardly what we need there.

> >

> > It would be better to delete Runes of Trooper for pvp/wvw since this is a large part of why shouts are run.

> >

> > Although a lot of your post talks about pvp/wvw, you bring up banner slaves, which I have only ever seen in raids/fractals. And as you admit, this is a dps spec that uses banners, it is not geared for +heal or +concentration.

> >

> > If an actual heal/boon spec was made, all you need to do is make utilities necessary to compete w shouts and banners, and possibly change Trooper runes and you are good to go.

>

> Why change trooper rune? it's not overpowered, it removes 1 condi.

> New E spec utilities are not there to replace core utilities like shouts but to offer alternatives or complete what's missing in group support, be it in range/radius or effect. I don't see why you should reduce shouts' effectiveness for new utilities when people often play 2/3 different types of utilities anyway.

 

I would rather see runes nerfed than core warrior abilities.

 

But trooper runes have been a problem for Tempest as well.

 

The reality is that cleansing has become super important in wvw and shouts and trooper runes are a big part of that.

[Acyk.9671]

> @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > @"Acyk.9671" said:

> > > @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > > > @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > > > > @"Opopanax.1803" said:

> > > > > > @"choovanski.5462" said:

> > > > > > I think y'all underestimate how good heal warrior is right now. it's the meta healer in spvp right now with tempest, and it was just nerfed last patch. it's a better support than any guardian, druid or rev centaur build right now, even after big nerfs.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > warrior is also meta on minstrel shout heals for boon strip and support in WvW too.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > adding more support to this class is just going to make it overkill, and either the spec or tactics will have to be gutted for the sake of balance, as support warrior right now is already so strong it's basically the only way to play the class in PvP modes. as for PvE, everyone already knows about banners no need to go over them.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > a mobility utility spec with pistols would be far better. you know something that might let warrior play damage on side node in PvP again. a support spec that would be so broken it would have to be nerfed on launch or break the game is really NOT what we need.

> > > > >

> > > > > You folks keep calling warrior with banner in pve "Support". This is not accurate. It is a dps spec that slots group buff utilities.

> > > > >

> > > > > In no way is a banner slave a support in any sense of a minstrel or harrier firebrand, renegade, druid, or tempest in pve.

> > > > >

> > > > > You don't play them or gear them like support, you gear and play them like dps...because they are.

> > > >

> > > > feel like you completely missed the point of my WvW and sPvP focused post my dude.

> > > >

> > > > still, I would classify a full bar of group buff utilities as being a support. not a healer sure, but an offensive support none the less.

> > > >

> > > > regardless, in two of three gamemodes warrior is stuck playing heal support. power creep to this role is hardly what we need there.

> > >

> > > It would be better to delete Runes of Trooper for pvp/wvw since this is a large part of why shouts are run.

> > >

> > > Although a lot of your post talks about pvp/wvw, you bring up banner slaves, which I have only ever seen in raids/fractals. And as you admit, this is a dps spec that uses banners, it is not geared for +heal or +concentration.

> > >

> > > If an actual heal/boon spec was made, all you need to do is make utilities necessary to compete w shouts and banners, and possibly change Trooper runes and you are good to go.

> >

> > Why change trooper rune? it's not overpowered, it removes 1 condi.

> > New E spec utilities are not there to replace core utilities like shouts but to offer alternatives or complete what's missing in group support, be it in range/radius or effect. I don't see why you should reduce shouts' effectiveness for new utilities when people often play 2/3 different types of utilities anyway.

>

> I would rather see runes nerfed than core warrior abilities.

>

> But trooper runes have been a problem for Tempest as well.

>

> The reality is that cleansing has become super important in wvw and shouts and trooper runes are a big part of that.

 

And the alternative is almost always monk rune at least on classes providing a decent amount of boons and heals so i don't see a problem.

I would actually like having more runes affecting mechanics, too many meme ones

 

EDIT: If Anet is going to release a support Espec it won't be the exact replicate of what support you currently get from shouts. It would give other boons or heal/cleanse in a different manner.

[Crackmonster.2790]

I really hope we will see some sort of staff build - i really think pistol would be meh. It's such a boring thing, i want smash. With my staff cracking they skulls.

[Hannelore.8153]

I think the biggest mistake they made was giving Firebrand Quickness.

 

Warrior was supposed to be the offensive support spec, the class that boosts allies' damage numbers, while Guardian heals, protects & cleanses, with both of them being somewhat tanky, so they could front-line.

 

Instead we have Guardians surviving better and doing more damage for both the player and the group with half the HP. What does Warrior have to define itself in comparison, more weapons and more CC? Guardian has almost as many weapons and almost as much CC, too. And while Revenant doesn't have the weapon choices, they have nearly everything else the other Heavies offer, and more.

 

I enjoy playing all of them, but what is the purpose of a Warrior? Playing a Healbreaker as my main in WvW is fun, but like all other Warrior builds its not fully fleshed out;, everything's just a hodge-podge of seemingly unfinished concepts.

 

The only thing being a Warrior gets me is being about to wear half Zealots since I don't need as much defense.

[Pati.2438]

@Yasai.3549 to be fair ... i would be so happy if they do that!!! Like for real Warrior should be warrior .... high dps and cc ... or as i hope for the new e-spec to be a buff support (maybe staff) with cc. Yes at first it would kick dps Warrior out of the PvE meta for sure ... but well you could simply buff waepon skills as well to evoid that issue and that would be the perfect thing that could happen to warrior in this moment xd

[Raizel.1839]

I'd like a top dps option which feels better than Berserker.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

Top dps option that also increases teammates offensive capabilites, thats a warrior imo.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

> @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> Top dps option that also increases teammates offensive capabilites, thats a warrior imo.

 

When you use a burst allies in range deal an extra 800 damage per strike for the next 5s. Can crit, blockable.

 

Stuff like that?

[Grand Marshal.4098]

I actually hate SUpport Spellbreaker in WvW, so instead of running shouts, I go full tank and stay around for the strips. I see more use in being a power warrior who strips boons than a splash heal warrior who dies if the enemy pushes too hard. #GoPower , trait strips and you got a warrior who is in the frontline and has no issue with it. Better strip 300 boons than fart some 3k heal. Warrior duelist for next espec. I can only hope.

[Psycoprophet.8107]

> @"Lan Deathrider.5910" said:

> > @"Psycoprophet.8107" said:

> > Top dps option that also increases teammates offensive capabilites, thats a warrior imo.

>

> When you use a burst allies in range deal an extra 800 damage per strike for the next 5s. Can crit, blockable.

>

> Stuff like that?

 

Or battle cry's that are a actual significant aoe boost to teammates dps, could have 3 tiers that u have to build up to 3rd tier, each higher tier grants a greater boon to itself and Ally's. U could also have a defensive battle cry that uses same resource that gives defensive boons such as damage reduction through a significantly in crease in armor. Maybe that's a boring idea tho lol lastly they should buff warrior banners, be cool if they actually gave boons significant enough to run them in pvp and wvw.

[Aaron.1294]

Warrior already have support spec - it's called spellbreaker

 

[Aaron.1294]

also warrior as a support is even more boring than a other non-support builds so pls no

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

> @"Aaron.1294" said:

> Warrior already have support spec - it's called spellbreaker

>

 

More of a control/dps. The support from the meta spellbreaker builds comes from Tactics, boon removal/denial itself is a form of control. Berserker is the Damage spec. There is no true 'support' espec for warrior, though when we get it it would be support with some dps traits.

 

The means of the support depends on how they build it and could very well be an enjoyable experience. Something that procs off of your bursts for instance, or something more tactical like laying down fields and blasting them for enhanced effects rather than press utility button grant AoE support.

[draxynnic.3719]

> @"Lan Deathrider.5910" said:

> > @"Aaron.1294" said:

> > Warrior already have support spec - it's called spellbreaker

> >

>

> More of a control/dps. The support from the meta spellbreaker builds comes from Tactics, boon removal/denial itself is a form of control. Berserker is the Damage spec. There is no true 'support' espec for warrior, though when we get it it would be support with some dps traits.

>

> The means of the support depends on how they build it and could very well be an enjoyable experience. Something that procs off of your bursts for instance, or something more tactical like laying down fields and blasting them for enhanced effects rather than press utility button grant AoE support.

 

Yeah, there's also a berserker version of the tactics/shout warrior, although it doesn't have the defences that the healbreaker has. The support is definitely coming from core warrior, not the elite spec, spellbreaker is just used for Full Counter and the dagger.

[Smoosh.2718]

> @"Tseison.4659" said:

> Well, Warriors will almost 99.9% get Staff as their next weapon and will serve as a "lance" or "polearm" because if you've played through Champions in LS, you can see the Champion Watchknights that follow you, using a lance and a spinning ability with it. :/ So if anything you guys will probably get that weapon with aoe damage and mobility like utility skills. *shrugs*

 

Whoa there how did i miss commenting on this statement. Sorry its late in this case.

 

However, we already have the introduction of Heavy armoured Norn with two pistols, Char running around exclusvily in heavy armour and two pistols while giving allies might. This is what I believe is the hint for warriors next elite weapon. (These can be found on the Drizzlewood Coast)

 

This being said... there is another class on Lake Doric a heavy armoured seraph soldier holding... what looks like a 'spaded' spear with what I would describe as the worst animation in the game for an odd spin attack (this is the part people forget, if warrior gets spear it will be the WORST animated weapon in the game.) These spade spear seraph i really hope are just flavour NPC's for that map and not the actual elite spec weapon.

 

This being said for the fact that we have two races now using Pistol Pistol, Pistol is the more likely elite spec weapon, for lore sake its fitting, the charr are opening up to other races, sharing their tech and training. Teaching warriors how to use their weapons (I hope many others can see how it fits to the lore as well as fitting to the class). This is why I believe Pistol is the weapon we will rightfully see.

 

 

If for some silly reason we get staff/spear... just you wait and watch everyone wish we got a different weapon. If I'm wrong I'll eat a hat. But im confident in what I believe to be right.

[Smoosh.2718]

In addition to my above post. These are the current classes ingame that could be used as elite spec hints:




 

 

I know many people do not like the idea of this, however I believe it could function, if on the next Expansion they remove the restriction on weapons. So if you so choose to you could use Dagger and Torch together (some weapons would need to be reworked so they dont rely solely on elite spec traits (E.g. Engineers holo sword) This would also allow players to run a core build with elite weapons, keeping the options open for even more build combinations. This potentially could be something in EoD increasing the players access to weapon types, allowing even classes like Ele to not be gimped on every weapon they get (seriously look at their options, Dagger, Sceptor or sword if traited main hand or Dagger, Focus or Warhorn if traited. Remove that restriction and classes will feel more fluid with their weapons, allowing them to do attack combinations utilising both main hand and offhand weapons. (as lets face it, core weapons are still stuck in 2013).

[draxynnic.3719]

Pretty sure the polearm Seraph are supposed to be relatively mookish _guardians._ Their leap attack looks a lot like Leap of Faith (guardian greatsword 3) to me.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

The Seraph generally all have guardian vibes fwiw.

 

We have two heavy classes with staff as a weapon, but none with pistols. So are these pistol heavy armor npcs doing guardian or revenant type skills or are they doing general pew-pew skills?

 

That right there is your set of clues to look for if the npcs are what you all are basing your predictions on.

[felix.2386]

tbh i'd rather warrior get third weapon slot instead of new weapon, so perhaps warrior can finally use it's large pool of weapon selection instead of only using 2 out of 20

[Super Hayes.6890]

> @"felix.2386" said:

> tbh i'd rather warrior get third weapon slot instead of new weapon, so perhaps warrior can finally use it's large pool of weapon selection instead of only using 2 out of 20

 

Interesting idea. I think that could be fun.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

> @"Super Hayes.6890" said:

> > @"felix.2386" said:

> > tbh i'd rather warrior get third weapon slot instead of new weapon, so perhaps warrior can finally use it's large pool of weapon selection instead of only using 2 out of 20

>

> Interesting idea. I think that could be fun.

 

could take a rifle or longbow along with your GS+X/Shield sets.

[Jagblade.4627]

Please no, half of warrior's main builds are already support builds like banner slaves.

 

> @"Lan Deathrider.5910" said:

> Yes, but with Pistols, or a land spear. Keep you staff.

 

Also please no. Don't turn P/P into a support build if we get it. Warriors needs a viable ranged DPS build. The rifle has been nerfed into the ground and the bows while not quite as useless are still pretty useless.